 | | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
Snipped. (...) There's a lot of stuff out there if you want to dig. I don't, since I'm already convinced and I don't much care for your thoughts either way. However, for the other readers... Here's a book reference for you: (URL) that these authors (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) One book on guns I bought back in college (while in college I used to do some very serious research for my roleplaying games), written by a police man, talked about various decisions in chosing a gun for home defence. He did point out that a (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) While some people were working the theme for humor value, who was actually arguing that point in a serious way? No one. You need to draw some meaningful conclusion from it or it has no relevance. That's not just an opinion, that's the way (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I asked for that :-) Scott A (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) ... and people without guns still kill people. (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) This is quite a good example, in a odd way. Car manufactures strive to make there cars safer to reduce death/injury rates for both owners and others - it helps sell cars. Have gun manufactures done the same in any real way? (...) Gun accidents (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Free to do what exactly? Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) People with guns kill people. Scott A (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) My point is that, even when well trained (and I doubt you are), when a person fires a gun the bullet can end up almost anywhere. (...) In your opionion. Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
Scott, Larry & Tim, Well, I understand this whole debate came from the initial posting of gun control. And I agree that controlling guns may not have the desired affect upon gun related crimes, since only law-abiding citizens will register. But (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
Well, I understand this whole debate came from the initial posting of gun control. And I agree that controlling guns may not have the desired affect upon gun related crimes, since only law-abiding citizens will register. But lately, it sounds like (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Thanks Larry....agree with most of your post except... (...) Yes, you are correct. However, I must point out that we're probably the most free non-free nation in the world. For all intents and purposes we consider ourselves free: ... God keep (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) No, not really. I think that your average Lego fan is of above average inteligence, and is more likely to follow through in actually being reasonably careful to unload the gun before trying to clean it :) It is also possible/probable that of (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Call the question. Are we arguing ballistics, or discussing the role of a well regulated militia in a free society? (or even in Canada, not quite free at this time) I'm confused. For the record, I concede that there is a non zero probability (...) (24 years ago, 10-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Think about this for a moment: 1) Are all walls the same? 2) Are all washing machines the same? 3) What angle will a bullet hit a wall at? 4) What angle will a bullet hit a washing machine at? I concede that a bullet may well go through a wall (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I'm not sure if your quip was meant to be humors, but I’ll answer it regardless. My slogan is indeed NOT an oxymoron ‘-Lego good, Canada great-®.’ Although I may not agree with the current situation, I'm still proud of my nation (Ranked #1 by (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Well I guess that you and I aren't acutally debating that much then since my original post to start this thread was arguing specifically the new gun registration laws. Requirements for a liscence and training are and have been for at least a (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Hey Larry, we were talking about Canadian gun control here....don't get me all riled up in the Canada vs. US debate....I'll be in front of the computer all night :) mumble mumble.....ignorant americmumble stupimumble bastamumble don't know (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Hold on a second here! Who's saying what????? First you make the comment that the bullet is going to bounce of the washing machine and then you agree with me that it could both go through a wall or a washing machine.....which is what I said in (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Family values?
|
|
"Christopher Weeks" <clweeks@eclipse.net> wrote in message news:G6t0JK.3Jw@lugnet.com... (...) or (...) Weeks (...) thread), (...) If (...) Chris, Before we begin, could I ask you to be a little more explicit as to your position as regards sexual (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) So why is the USA & Canada so different on this? I know that there are other countries where guns are very common but gun deaths are very low (Sweden?). I found murder rates for the Americas (below), Canada is higher than my UK estimate of (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) It is a generalisation, but people in the areas Larry alludes to do not feel part of the "system" - they feel excluded from it. I know from personal experiences, that individuals in these areas are very reluctant to go to the police for help - (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Being a Puget Sound native (My home addresses in my lifetime have been Oak Harbor, Seattle, or Bellingham) I can tell you that jaywalking is practicly a capital offense in Seattle. OK, maybe not that bad. How did the old joke go, getting (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Well...if people aren't safe, and the system is set up to prevent them from keeping themselves safe, and people generally believe that police keep them safe, then what's wrong with how Larry put it? Obviously it isn't (usually) the cops' (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I really would be interested in your justification for making the above comments, or was it just based on ill-informed rumour? If you can show that a UK crime "hot spot" is even comparable to one in your land, I truly will be enlightened. The (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Oh, sure, there's that stuff later in the evening. All in all, however, Seattle is one of the safer cities in my experience. LMK next time you're in town. Maybe you can stop by a SEALUG meeting. (...) Heh. Well, there is a certain reputation (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) All historical context aside, jackboots are pretty cool, and go a long way towards a sharp-looking uniform. It's an interesting (though mostly unreasolvable) question wether they had the jackboots in spite of, or because of, historical (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I'm not James, of course, but I was warned about being in downtown Seattle ( by the fish market, the area where the monorail lets out, etc) late at night. I happened to *be* downtown late at night soon after, and there were a lot of people (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) From what I've heard from Fiat owners, they were never examples of greatness. ;^) ~Mark "Muffin Head" Sandlin (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.off-topic.fun)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) You've been warned about Seattle? Really? What have people warned you about? Just curious, since I live in the Seattle area and I think it's pretty safe in general. ~Mark "Muffin Head" Sandlin (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
Richard makes some good points, Canada is indeed different than the US in many ways. So I snipped them. (...) Indeed. Given the above, can you help me reconcile the apparent contradiction in your slogan: (...) as this new fiat doesn't seem an (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Yep, I do not live in a gun culture. (...) I'm pretty sure it could do both. Think about this for a moment. Scott A (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Much of this conversation is dealing with U.S. and U.K. statistics, situations and stereotypes. Yet, the principle issue is restrictions and controls within ‘Canada.’ My nation is quite different from the U.S. in many key areas, and several of (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: how police forces compare internationally? (was Re: My Gun Control Rant)
|
|
(...) Surely any study of police productivity would be biased by varying levels of corruption. For instance in Sydney and Brisbane criminal activity has traditionally been kept under control by the police through mutually profitable compromises. So (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Of course, now that I think about it, if the washing machine is on spin cycle, I guess it would have considerable angular momentum. And if you were washing particularly stiff fabrics, the two factors together could very likely create a (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) That's why I think parts of the law are -stupid-, but parts of it to my mind make sense- such as requiring licences that have as a requirement, training. It comes down to the fact that we needed some changes to the law, but what we got was (...) (24 years ago, 9-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I think we're arguing about a matter of wording here - While it is true that you should never point a gun at a person without AT LEAST being in a state where it is "OK" _IF_ the gun does get fired and does kill (in a situation where the other (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I'm sorry but obviously you're not terribly aware of the nature of a moving bullet. From previous conversations, you're telling me the bullet cn go through a wall but not through a household washing machine? Think about this for a moment. (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Family values?
|
|
(...) The crux of marriage is indeed fidelity, duty, and commitment...but fidelity, duty and commitment are not owed by the betrothed merely to oneanother, but also to the moral absolutes which have pressing claim on their conduct. If you do not (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Well, I believe the technical term here in Canada is Attempted Murder, or at least Assault with a Weapon. My firearms instructors included members who had served in all kinds of nice international vacation spots, such as Cyprus, Yogo, (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Then your washing machine must be heavily armor-plated, considering the ammunition Lar uses. Otherwise the slug will go through the washing machine or any other appliance in the house. Dave! (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Very well put....I must thank you for this as I tend to somehow end up discussing gun control fairly regularily recently and I've never actually heard it put this way....I shall remember it. (...) I agree here. To kill another human being I (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) ... and what is the bullet bouces of the washing machine? (...) Yet most have the sense to raid only empty homes. (...) Well, the US murder rate is >3 times the UK one. I am pretty sure that our murder clear-up rate is better than the USA too. (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: News to get your head spinning
|
|
(...) though: (...) It's not "not anybody's fault". The fault lies with all of us for supporting a system which considers it more important to stop prostitution than to give folks the help they need. The fault lies with us for not having non-prison (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
I would count a $50 revolver as just as dangerous to the user as the target! There's NO WAY a company can sell a gun at a profit at $50 retail without massively cutting corners on alloys and machining tolerances. (...) -- | Tom Stangl, Technical (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) What is your argument....please think about what you've said....obviously you will analyze that whenever you are in the situation. At what point did Larry mention he would fire at any criminal no matter what the cost....I think you're aware (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) The criminals are not armed (mostly), so the police do not need them. (...) What? Tony Blair goes mad, and the army supports him - I doubt it. What would his aim be? (...) Have you been watching Rambo? Scott A (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) How can you say that? What would the presence/absence of guns have to do with the social situation. There are no guarantees that government will not "turn bad". What I'm saying is that IF the social situation WERE to turn bad, you might (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) crappy gun (...) My personal recommendation would be to purchase the gun that is closest to your ideal and still within your price range. But I think it's better to have a $50 .32 revolver than nothing. And a gun has to be pretty screwed up to (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | News to get your head spinning
|
|
Hi all, Recently a thread on duped dads sprouted from a news piece. Wow. That would really suck. How about this one? I think this sucks too. (URL) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Family values?
|
|
"Christopher Weeks" <clweeks@eclipse.net> wrote in message news:G6t0JK.3Jw@lugnet.com... (...) or (...) Weeks (...) thread), (...) If (...) Chris, I just saw your note and will try to post something tomorrow. Take care, Steve (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | how police forces compare internationally? (was Re: My Gun Control Rant)
|
|
(...) Noted. I often wonder how police forces compare internationally. However, I expect it is a pretty hard thing to do due to cultural differences – this means that what constitutes a crime may change from state to state (e.g. trespassing is not (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) In this particular case, I CAN'T agree. There really is no reason for a crappy gun (that's just as liable to injure the user as the target) to exist. If you're going to buy a gun, you should buy a GOOD one, even if it's used and rebuilt. -- | (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) That's quite amazing to me. Does he have to have a proverbial knife to your throat/bat to your skull before you're able to act, or is there some point at which his presence or actions are sufficient to infer forcible self-defense as an (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) In the UK, the "potential danger" is almost nil. If I killed him in anything other than strict self defense, I'd be of to jail. See: (URL) If that (...) If he does not have the right to sue in the US... why/how does it happen? Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) Oh. Well, you don't expect me to pay attention when I'm typing, to you? (...) I think you meant "they may have been wrong." Anyway, I'm not sufficiently well-versed in the Waco story, but there are many who identify the use of riot tanks as (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) I was using what you said... "Branch Davidians _perceived_ a rampage". It may have been their "perception" - but they have been wrong. (...) In either case, s/he'd be breaking the law. That, however, does not mean I have the absolute right to (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Ugh, ain't that the truth! My father once advised me that if I ever shot a burglar in my house who then managed to crawl outside, I should drag him back in and shoot him again to prevent such a lawsuit. (...) **snip** (...) Interesting. In the (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Yes, if coupled with tort reform so I wasn't in mortal peril of losing all my posessions from a lawsuit brought by a burglar or mugger. (...) It's a small but non zero fear. I don't think it makes my days frightful and lonely, it just means (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) But can't you say that about everything in a debate of this sort? And if you're going to make a relativist claim like that, then you undermine your own stance, as well. I perceive a burglar entering my home, but he perceives himself as a (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) It is all a matter of perception. (...) Ruby Ridge? (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: California Power "Deregulation"
|
|
(...) <snip> What's really fun about all this is that my power bill in WA is going way up because our power companies want to sell our power to CA. They're calling it a "shortage," however. There are all sorts of advertisements on the radio and TV (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Out of curiosity, would you be equally satisfied with a hypothetical non-lethal weapon that nonetheless instantly and fully incapacitated its target? Something like an immediate tranquilizer (or a phaser-set-on-stun, perhaps?) I'm asking (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) I'm sure the Branch Davidians perceived a rampage to be in the air, and folks around Ruby Ridge might likewise agree that the guvmint sometimes forcibly oversteps its bounds. Dave! (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) It is right here - (URL) of these are suicides (inc ~120 under 14). Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I doubt it. I'll try to provide references from less biased (i.e. biased in my favor ;-) tonight or tomorrow. Chris (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I don't think we are disagreeing. I posted this example in order to address the (semantic?) issue of motive for doing things... not to claim that there aren't different niches, different price points and different needs. GM's problem is that (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
In general, I agree with Bill's note. But... (...) Some war. Not most, for most participants. Chris (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
Mostly agree so mostly snipped. (...) Matter of semantics? I'm not a good enough bluffer to use a realistic toy in a standoff, so I bought something that's capable of killing, not just a BB gun or pea shooter. I need to have the real thing behind my (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) free (...) But look at the little Korean companies and compare those to Toyota. Hyundai's sell. They are made at significantly lower quality levels, but still they sell. Why? Because the niche that they market to wants Toyotas but can only (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) What do you mean by "better?" I have had minor formal firearms training and have practiced at the range on numerous (though not as much as I should, recently) occasions. (...) Silly macho posturing. There are lots of reasons that one might aim (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) Realistically, what do you think the chances are of your government gonig on the "rampage"? Scott A (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Family values?
|
|
(...) pay (...) possibility (...) I don't usually do this, but... Yeah! What she said. I certainly never meant to imply that the false-father wasn't a vicitim. He's the worst one. Chris (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Family values?
|
|
(snipped, but I don't think unduely so) (...) At the same time, society has already invested a great deal of resources into the adult and almost none into the kid. From the point of view of "society," doesn't it make more sense to value the adult? (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I don't have time to grubb about too much, but I did find this: There were 98 murders in Scotland in 1999 (Scotland has the worst rate in the UK). The population is ~6M (10% of UK) - so that gives a murder rate of ~1.63/100K. Gun murders (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) OK. So who is in the next room? Your kids? Your dog? Your neighbours? (...) Show me they are wrong. 51% of all gun deaths are suicides – perhaps the gun owners are unstable? Statistically, the person who is most likely to murder your family is (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) USA _only_. Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) But I think it is that way because there are no/little guns. I am pretty sure I have seen no more than 5-10 non-military guns in my 32 years here. All those 5-10 were in the hands of the police. Scott A (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I disagree profoundly. There is a huge difference between pointing a gun at someone in order to prevent myself (or someone else) from being killed, and pointing a gun at someone to kill them. My intent is not to kill them, it is to stop them (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) And we could take it a step further. How many of those firearm deaths are alchohol related? I have no way of finding that statistic, but there must be a percentage. I sincerely feel bad for the good, ordinary people of Canada, as well as the (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) Where would this end? Do you think it's reasonable that wealthy individuals or corporations should have tanks, fighter jets etc in their private possession? Or that they would actually bother to defend the "citizenry" against the government (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
(...) The only reason the 2nd might be ineffective against government firepower is that we have allowed the government to overly restrict the weapons an individual may possess. At this point, we better darn well hope that if the government goes on a (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I think I disagree. At least I disagree that if one draws, one's ONLY possible intent is to kill. Drawing a gun has an amazing affect on people (I know, I've had a gun drawn on me, now that search is working again, you can even go look it up). (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: California Power "Deregulation"
|
|
Hm, this is starting to sound a bit like what happened to the power company in New Hampshire. They started to build a nuke plant which Massachusetts kept from opening (one strategy was to refuse to create an evacuation plan). The power company was (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) As I've argued many a time. We are not served well by bowing down to the holy brick and no other. Frank (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Family values?
|
|
(...) No, I agree he's a victim too. If anyone is not a victim in all this it would be the mother, who should have informed both of her partners of the possibility that either of them could be the father at the very beginning. Maggie C. (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) May be a matter of semantics, I guess. When GM designs a car, do they design it to be a good car, or to sell the units needed to hit the IRR? Er, bad example. Who knows what moves GM these days, it's embarrassing that they're HQed in the state (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
Mostly agree with this post, with one nuance... (...) Well, some would argue that it *is* possible to "aim to wound", but I think you need to be a far better shot to pull that off. (unless you use rubber bullets, which often don't work anyway) (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Blame it on cosmic rays... (Not to be confused with Cosmic Ray's brickbay shop) (URL) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.off-topic.fun)
|
| |
| | Foundation of a republic (was Gun control)
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek has been snipped... (...) Although Australia is a constitutional backwater (no bill of rights, still a monarchy etc) our High Court has come up with some interesting jurisprudence on this point. Rather (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) myself (...) If you aim a gun at me, (as my basic training would say), you'd better have a dammed good reason for wanting to kill me-or have you never had formal firearms training? If you aim at someone, then the ONLY possible reason is that (...) (24 years ago, 8-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I believe I had some stray electrons move the knife and gun around, just like Larry P. has happen occasionally :) (it should have been easier to kill with a gun than a knife...that'd be better eh?) James (24 years ago, 7-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) Well, it could be argued you ARE using ineffectual ammo ;-) The most destructive is that which expands and STAYS in the body, tearing it to shreds. Oh wait, dum-dums are illegal. Nevermind, stick with your hollowpoints and massive exit wounds (...) (24 years ago, 7-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Family values?
|
|
So the only one that isn't a victim is the non-biological father forced to pay child support? That's the largest pile of bovine dung I've ever heard! (...) -- Tom Stangl ***(URL) Visual FAQ home ***(URL) Bay Area DSMs (24 years ago, 7-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Family values?
|
|
I meant he wouldn't be much of a victim to be forced to pay child support due to his previous action. I thought that was obvious. I KNOW *I* don't have any children in the world, and never will. (...) -- Tom Stangl ***(URL) Visual FAQ home ***(URL) (...) (24 years ago, 7-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
As always, snipped. (...) I go to the range enough that I don't often miss. But... the bullets I use go through the body and then through the wall anyway, even if I don't miss. I don't like to use something ineffectual. But others do miss. Accidents (...) (24 years ago, 7-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
Hugely snipped... (...) Precisely. And what the lord(1) giveth, the lord taketh away. That's my point. The US is (theoretically(2)) constrained in what rights it can usurp because the US is founded on the principle that rights come from the (...) (24 years ago, 7-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) So, tell me again, WHY in the heck do we have to get a liscense to purchase amunition? What's wrong with a drivers liscence or other proof-of-age certificate? Oh, how dumb of me, could it be that there IS a reason we have to shell out huge (...) (24 years ago, 7-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) I believe that you just severly contradicted your entire preceding argument. (24 years ago, 7-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: My Gun Control Rant
|
|
(...) How do those numbers compare in the UK? What if you add in all non-firearm (non vehicular) murders? (...) I'd bet so. (...) Maybe Brittons (is that right?) are less likely to kill one another. You can't suggest a causal relationship based on (...) (24 years ago, 7-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
