 | | Re: Pathemata Mathemata
|
|
(...) Not that it matters-- I was just tweaking you:-) The point was the humor of Rooney quoting French as he's about to (as far as he knows) bust Ferris. BTW, he himself translates for us: "The game is up". -John (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Are some of you guys making it too easy on the rest of us?
|
|
I think he refuted your 5:1 quite well within the short time constraints he had. He certainly did a good job as far as *I* was concerned in showing there was nowhere near a 5:1 ratio. I'm sure he could do the same for HoR, but if you think he did (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Are some of you guys making it too easy on the rest of us?
|
|
(...) Refuted it? Hardly. First off, choosing the senate as a basis for investigation is flawed from the start because their terms are so long. Second, he calls a senator who has merely won his third term (but not served 1 day of the third term) a (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Pathemata Mathemata
|
|
I ran it through Babelfish, but it didn't make much sense - "plays its fact". A basic search did not bring up a good translation within 30sec or so, so yes, I got lazy (see my other thread about people making it too easy on the rest of us). It was (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Are some of you guys making it too easy on the rest of us?
|
|
More often than not, I find myself not replying to many points in a discussion, because I just KNOW that by the time I start doing any decent research, one of you will have completed their research and posted the results by then (e.g., Chris' (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Pathemata Mathemata
|
|
(...) Personally, I tired after looking up "mote";-) Did you search my French line, or were *you* too lazy? :-) -John (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Pathemata Mathemata
|
|
BTW, for those that were too stubborn/ignorant/lazy to look it up, typing "pathemata mathemata" into the Location bar of Communicator gave the following match in less than 1 second: (URL) of: pathemata mathemata (Greek) pathemata mathemata (Greek): (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes: <snip> (...) That's it! I voiced the same opinion as both Scott and John in under 2 days!!! Now I just have to say something that goes with what Dave! says and I will cease to exist!! Dave (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) Precisely. And all said, we will never know. The theories of Evolution and "Creationism" (I'd call it a belief, not a theory, but whatever) are 2 sides of the same coin. *Neither* are proveable, and the debate is similar to the "existence of (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) You are wrong, and I will correct you. According to scientists (including non-Creationist), the definitions are these: Microevolution: The theory that natural selection, over time, take an organism and transform it into a more specialized (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Creationism
|
|
(...) Evolution makes many claims that can be tested. One deals with the order in which fossil records are deposited in strata, and in this respect is has proven correct again and again. Another is in the types of transitional fossils that will (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Lindsay Frederick Braun writes: <snip> Most of the time in these debates, I feel like the 5 year old trying to understand his older brother and his buddies talking about the stuff they learned in grade 8--sometimes is (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Lindsay Frederick Braun writes: <snip> (...) Pure Creationists believes that the Earth really was created in exactly 6 days, and ignore any scientific eveidence to the contrary. S.C.s (at least me, tell me if i'm wrong (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) The same could be said about evolution. You can't prove macroeveolution in a lab, it makes no claims that can be tested, it uses no evidence that cannot be used for the S.C. theory (the type I believe in anyway). (...) This is totally (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) Oh, I agree. But were I a Christian, I would still see the overwhelming evidence, believe in evolution as the most likely explanation of the origin of species, and search for a way to justify my religious belief with my scientific observation. (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) "Oxymoron" may have been a cruel overstatement, but I stand by my assertion that there is nothing scientific about Creationism. However, in another post, I recognized the error of my absolutist stance and acknowledge that it's fair to call (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) I agree, and hope that Dave(!) will reconsider. Since it is a name of a belief/theory, and the name is reasonably illustrative of what the theorists are thinking about, I think the name is fit. (...) That's completely wrong. Plenty of (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) What's the difference between "pure Creationism" and "Scientific Creationism?" Both are based on anti-logic, and both are necessarily rooted in theistic dogma. If you want to produce a totally non- sectarian vision of spontaneous generation ex (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) Please don't misunderstand me--I reject "Scientific Creationism" as a term because there is nothing at all scientific about it. It makes no claims that can be tested, it calls for no experiments that can be repeated, it uses no evidence that (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) This claim got me interested. I decided that a thorough analysis of the past fifty years of US politics was beyond my level of interest. So I narrowed my exploration to the current US Senate. I sifted and sorted some stats and came up with: 50 (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) Just like military intelligence or whatever... There are scientists who are Christian, and they came up with a theory and they called it Scientific Creationism, in which they try to merge the Biblical stories of creatin with scientific (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) would (...) I didn't say more wouldn't run. It's just that they wouldn't *win*. (...) Displacing an incumbent is statistically difficult. They already have the advantage in a reelection attempt. Limiting $$$ hurts the challengers. And BTW, (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I thought it was somewhere in the UK. (...) Our wisdom teeth are primarily for mashing grains and tough fiberous roots. (...) Chaos accounts for the existence of cells of spontaneous order in a chaotic system. If you add heat to a pan of water (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Curt Tigges writes: First of all, "Scientific Creationism" is an oxymoron, so let's dispense with that term and stick with Creationism. (...) Actually, it's a *theory,* just as the theory of gravitation, the theory of (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) We have the law of gravity, which has yet to be disproven--when I let go of a hammer it will fall. We see that today. We can test that today. How do we prove 'evolution', which happened millions and/or billions of yeara ago? There have been (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
Congratulations, John. In your responses below you have proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that you cannot read anything over 1-2 sentences long and comprehend it. That, or that you simply refuse to comprehend it (which you proved with your last (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) It may not be freedom in *your* mind, John, but it is in mine. Freedom to run for office whether you have friends with millions in the bank or not. (...) Explain to me how no new people would run for office if the most they'd spend would be (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Evolution vs Scientific Creationism
|
|
(...) I don't think that most Christians (including me) believe that the Earth and Solar Sytem was created in 6 days (rotations of the Earth). Since there was no Earth to set the time, that wouldn't even make sense. I think that most (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | The constitution has been abrogated
|
|
Starting a new thread as the current monster one is rather a bad place to hang this.... In lugnet.off-topic.debate, (...) Not exactly wrong but not quite right either. As another poster explained, the authority is probably defacto rather than dejure (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Yes. (...) But actually, I was trying to indicate a specific thing when I wrote "strict creationism." I meant the belief that you describe above as dumb. The notion that God set up a bunch of physical laws several billion years ago, knowing (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I would (regrettably...) dispute that these traits are confined to (modern) liberals. In my own county you need look no further than the local GOP machine to find them, although the loyal Democratic opposition has them as well. Perhaps not as (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Then let's restate it this way: Of the explanations currently on the table for how we arrived where we are today, evolution provides more complete, explanatory answers and makes more accurate, testable predictions than Creationism, and (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Here in the US, we limit your hunting quota, your speed of travel, you ability to shout "fire," the percentage of your income that you get to keep, your ability to discriminate based on skin tone, and a million other things. So I guess we (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes: [snip] (...) Wow! Do you really think this?: (...) What is the value of just getting together and patting one another on the back for being American? Chris (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Little judgmental this morning, are we? To follow something blindly -- uneducated and (...) What's ignorant here is your elitism and your hatred. I thought lefties were supposed to be the tolerant ones... -- is really to favor a kind of (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) You said it. You "limit" the budgets. That's *not* freedom. The average winning candidate spends about $40,000.00. Think (...) So the liberal, career-politician incumbants can remain in power. No thanks. (...) One big reason is because they (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Only because I am finishing my breakfast and only because it is the day it is... I do have a problem with patriotism. It is the same problem I have with most "religious" people and their seemingly mad fervor for whatever thing they happen to (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: UK gets a raw deal again
|
|
Your right. Although the original name is french (Valenduc) the spelling was changed when some Hugenots moved to Holland a few centuries ago. My better half is from Limerick though, so we'd like our kids to be bilingual, hence the international (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: US healthcare (was: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.)
|
|
(...) I was careful not to mention the "poor". My comments focus on those just above the safety net and also do not include any “churn”. Scott A (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Gosh, that's great! I thought I was starting to sound like you. ;) Scott A (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Christopher L. Weeks writes: <snip> (...) Well, this statement kinda shows where you stand on the matter. Saying that Creationism *isn't* reality endorses that something else is. Unless you're an avid reader of Hitch (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) SC (...) positions (...) I go back and forth on what I think the base requirements for a school to use vouchers should be. I'm opposed to schools teaching e.g. strict creationism instead of reality, but I'm not sure I'd even support (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | US healthcare (was: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.)
|
|
(...) millions? This common stance ignores the fact that our poor often (at least) obtain medical care when it is needed. When I was a child, our family was poor. I was, however, vacinated at county clinics, had my tonsils removed when I was three, (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) because (...) Native Americans hunted some things to extinction in some places. Sustainability in the big picture can only be measured over long time periods which includes the ability to adapt. But by and large, I agree. OTOH, I personally (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur writes: <snip> (...) Oh My Goodness!!! I'm sounding like Scott!! AAAAAUUU...UUUGGGGGG...H!!!...!!! That's it--I bow out of this debate! ;) Dave (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) The past two UK general elections have produced MPs who got to power with virtually no funding. That is freedom. In the UK we limit MP’s political advertising budgets to allow open access to power. The average winning candidate spends about (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes: <snip> (...) Oh I'm so glad that I'm Canadian with our health care system. Yes there are those union bosses who say otherwise, and people can line up a whole bunch of people whining about the woes of (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) People can't have it both ways--they want the vouchers 'cause then they can send their kid to whatever school they think is best for their kid and at the same time say "oh you can't send *your* voucher (and therefore your kid) to *that* school (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) But then you are simply restricting freedoms. Pretty soon we'd end up like the UK>;-) (...) That you mentioned race-- what would that necessarily have to do with anything? (...) Damn right. People *need* to start *really* being colorblind, and (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I'd have to remember where I saw it, but something like 70% of all violent crimes are committed by repeat offenders. And what counts as a crime when compiling those (...) I don't think I ever asserted that. (...) *They* are a necessary evil to (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Many were upset that those vouchers were used to attend religious schools, allegedly at the state's expense. -John (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Indeed, but it is important to iron out any imperfections. You constitution allows political power to be bought and sold. Millionaires can buy elections. Third parties can run negative campaigns against candidates (eg NRA). Your embassies are (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Their lifestyle was sustainable - your one is not. Right now the world is paying the price the "material culture" you (collectively) enjoy/conform to. The ugly inefficiency of your subsidised steel "industry" is an example of this. The EU is (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) in (...) No, I don't. What is it? And what counts as a crime when compiling those numbers? And why is it that you think crimes that take place in prison are less important? I think the overall effect on the economy of fixing those who can be (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) You paint with too broad a brush, my good man. This atheist believes that school vouchers are the best thing since sliced bread. Seriously, I don't see vouchers as a religious issue at all. It's an educational freedom issue. And I want more! (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Do you know the percentage of crimes committed which are perpetrated by repeat offenders? If we just keep them in jail the first time, crime would plummet. -John (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Yes, you are correct. I think we are victims of our own success-- freedom has a price which one must be willing to pay; freedom without responsibility is anarchy and not freedom at all. (...) Can you say "pledge ruling"? I'm not sure that (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I'd think that effective occupation is really the deal. For us to have claimed the moon in 69 would have lead to strife because our claim would not have been honored. We couldn't deploy enough force to the moon to keep others off, so what (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Umm...do you know what it costs to incarcerate people. I don't have numbers in front of me, but I can only imagine that it would be cheaper for the US taxpayer to help them than to jail them. Chris (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Indeed. Canada chose to fight for the freedom of others. It chose to declare war in 1939 - not neutrality. Scott A (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) In many respects the USA is "Great". But so was Goliath. Economically and Militarly the USA is "great". But, increasingly, it has failed to be morally "Great". (...) You are free to conform to the norm. I would have more respect for your scrap (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: UK gets a raw deal again
|
|
Myself and a couple of friends spent a day there last year when we were cycling through Holland/Belgium. It was a warm day in the sun soaking up the local cultural offerings. It was outside term-time, so it was very quiet and quite relaxing. I doubt (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) "Largest" != greatest. But I think an imperialist attitude is extremely evident in American destinarianism (we're the greatest, therefore everyone else should take our lead). That's going to take us headlong into a bitter squabble with the PRC (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: UK gets a raw deal again
|
|
(...) Or South Africaness/Boerness ;-) Pedro (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) (snip) (...) Hardly. And they still managed to rush in help of the "mother nation" when it was needed - loyalty is still a quality! (...) Maybe this can help explain why there is resentment in Europe against the USA: they made fortune with (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: UK gets a raw deal again
|
|
(...) Leiden just happens to be where I lived while on research. Are you not Dutch (the international school)? The surname implies Dutchness. :) I didn't mind living in southwestern Leiden, but I lived north of Leiden-CS and that was less pleasant. (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Amen. (...) Take off:-) (...) Wimps;-) (...) Of course. But it wasn't *our* war yet (although we were exporting like mad to support the allies-- lend-lease, etc) The (...) Well, shouldn't it be thus? (...) Did you hear this on WW... >;^D (...) (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) The Chinese sold pasta to italian merchants. They "invented" gunpowder (I am not sure of the date, though). And they chose the ultimate path a great civilization can afford to, they ignored the rest of us *because they could afford to*. And up (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: UK gets a raw deal again
|
|
What's so great about Leiden? The only reason I live here is because of the international school in Leiderdorp that our daughter goes to. But I can't wait to leave Leiden behind me again. Do you know it's got the lowest average IQ in the country? (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) The usual leftist bilge, Richard? (...) Because freedom and responsibility go hand in hand. Many people don't understand that. (...) Show me in our Constitution where: 1. that is anywhere near the government's responsibility, and 2. why I (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Thank you! :-) (...) I used the expression "differnt context" for some reason. And I did not criticize the USA for any sort of Imperialist attitude, did I? (...) Innacurate: the Britons who originally left found life in the Colonies better; (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) It may be because of immigration regulations. (...) That sounds quite a bit simplified. The majority of immigrants come from neighboring countries. There have been a fair number of immigrants from Sweden lately, and they generally move over (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) The usual madness, John? We are amongst the most incarcerated people of any nation, and this is by percentage, not just numbers. Why do you suppose that is? One reason, and there are many others, is that we'd rather treat our drug addicts (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) And I guess that's also the point here--the gov't can say, 'Yes, we as a nation believe there's a God, but the individuals in the nation can believe whatever they please' and do this without having a 'State Run Religion'. Anywho, this has been (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Thank you Simon, for bringing up Liberia. Any nation whose Constitution guarantees the freedoms of its people deserves to be included among the greatest nations on earth. The table is set for that country-- the possibilities for them are (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) free of "Canada's Better, no the US is better" rhetoric): (URL) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) (URL) Dave! (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) OK, against my better judgement I'm going to wade in here. Thank you John for providing your very simple method of calculating greatness (with which I do not agree but I think coming up with a formula for such a thing would be like nailing (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes: <snip> (...) God bless us all. K, I'm saying it--I think Canada is the free-est nation on the planet 'cause we're not beholden to some piece of paper written 200+ years ago and therefore the greatest (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: Question Time is fine television.
|
|
(...) Shh! The overseas entertainment factor is one of the biggest reasons used to justify the "reform" of PMQ’s. Scott A (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Fine. Just show me a better one. (...) And I say again-- pick a greater one. (...) How can one say that we are great because of our people, and OTOH we are a nation of immigrants (people from *other* countries). Our people are (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Most people don't know that the US Army's Psychological Operations sends it's members out as interns at US news organizations. Think I'm kidding? (URL) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) This is one for the first things that I actually agreed with ;) (...) There is nothing with saying the USofA is great. My original issue was with saying it is the "Greatest" nation. The US is great, for numerous reasons which I may expound on, (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Foundation. The fact that he's right is irrelevant. (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) A bunch of immigrants were forced to come here. (...) Um...uh...well...we did! (...) to (...) Actually, I largely agree with this. The core of whatever greatness we have claim to (aside from the dumb luck, which is indisputable) is our (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) On the other hand, what have they done recently? Have the Chinese or Egyptians contributed to the world anything of note in the past thousand years? At all time and in all places, every accomplishment is made standing on the backs of giants. (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Where I was coming from wasn't giving anyone a moral scorecard. Just how they had impacted nations that followed. By noting that they were still vital wasn't trying to give any credence to whatever political atmosphere is currently going on, (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I know this is bad form, but I have to apologize for this statement-- I admit I was shooting from the hip there. But here is an evaluation of Norway allegedly being the best place on earth to live (and it's by a Norwegian, no less): (URL) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Well, let's compare apples to apples here. I said greatest *nation*-- you can hardly compare a nation to a civilization. Take either (...) ...please. (apologizes to Henny;-) which are still very vital world communities today. That's putting it (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) No, welcome! I'd acknowledge the United Kingdom as the greatest nation the world (...) That's funny. For those reasons the US gets criticized bitterly... (...) Yeah, and life in Britian became so intolerable for some that they *left* it to (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I will be more inclined to agree that China has continuously been an extremely important civilization, rather than Egypt (which is now only a part of a much wider culture). But yes, you have a point - ultimately, those who came before laid the (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I'm in full agreement with taking into consideration previous civilizations as greater in influence than what is currently the USA of today. Take either China or Egypt, which are still very vital world communities today. Most everything we (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Question Time is fine television.
|
|
(...) I mean, I don't know about the Canadian iteration, but I absolutely LOVE PM's Question Time in the UK. They show it at off times on CSPAN and sometimes it's just a hoot. Were it that all government activity were so entertaining. best LFB (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Really, read Stephanson. A large part of it *was* dumb luck, combined with lasseiz-faire attitudes (more out of a realization that the center could not control the edges than anything else) and a cultural touchpoint with the world's preeminent (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Sorry to pop in in this discussion like this, but I dispute this point of yours. I'd acknowledge the United Kingdom as the greatest nation the world has ever seen, even if its context was considerably different (colonial/imperial, I mean). You (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) What else would you expect? :-) (...) Well, I meant *in* history, not for all time. The US is the greatest nation to have ever existed, even though we've only been around for 200odd years. Heck, Americans have driven SUVs on the moon-- we've (...) (22 years ago, 2-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I know about shouting 'Fire!' in a crowded Theatre arguement--don't get bogged down in semantics. (...) And you're getting bogged down in semantics and slippery slopes--if you're afraid that your kid's going to get beat up 'cause he or she's (...) (22 years ago, 2-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I know, Dave! I was referring to the idea that the opinion of our razor-thin-plurality President is somehow sacrosanct and allows him to create a religion test for those who sit on the bench. LFB (22 years ago, 2-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) I guess then that this is up to the Supreme Court to decide? Wait, if the Pledge is 'voluntary' then it's Free Speech--those that don't want to say it don't have to, which then legitimizes my other arguement--if the kid gets picked on, it has (...) (22 years ago, 2-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
| |
| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
|
|
(...) Even here on (...) I'm going to forgive your foray off-topic in this NG just this once if you tell us and tell us NOW who knows what:-) (...) I would say that your characterization is slightly off-- should be whether the inclusion of "under (...) (22 years ago, 2-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
|
