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Subject: 
Re: Policy clarification regarding catalogs
Newsgroups: 
lugnet.admin.general, lugnet.off-topic.debate
Date: 
Sat, 18 Dec 1999 20:06:55 GMT
Viewed: 
46 times
  
In lugnet.admin.general, Jasper Janssen writes:
On Sat, 18 Dec 1999 06:18:02 GMT, "James Brown"
<galliard@shades-of-night.com> wrote:
In lugnet.admin.general, Jasper Janssen writes:

No, you're defining webserver differently.  I'm not going to bother quibbling
semantics with you.

Gee. That's rather a cop-out, isn't it?

If you insist.  But no amount of sniping is going to convince me that
"webserver"=public.  What about firewalls?  They're on an unsecured webserver,
too - does that make them "public?"

Ah!  I see the problem here - you're arguing legalities.  I don't care two
hoots for the legalities of the issue, I'm talking common courtesy.

This is not about courtesy. At all.

This is about a claim Brad made that it was _legally_ so. I am not
saying it isn't impolite (though I don't agree..), I am saying it
isn't illegal. _That_ is the claim that needs to be challenged. I am
not going to let some clueless corporate lawyer (whichever company he
is from) and an equally clueless judge completely screw up the
internet as we know it, if I can help it.

And I am saying I don't care about the legalities.  I don't think the
legalities are an issue.  There is sufficient established precedent (IMHO) to
knock down anyone attempted to claim more under copyright law than they are
entitled to.

As I said to Matthew very early on, molehills do not equal mountains.

Certainly it is the originators right to determine "intent to publish", not
Joe Public.

Oh. So if I print a few hundred folders, crop-dust them over the inner
city, then say that everyone who's read it, or shown it to friends, or
given it away has violated my copyright because I didn't intend to
publish it, I have a leg to stand on?

You're being ridiculous - the analogy fails on several levels.  For one
thing, the actions you describe are intent to publish.

Oh, really? I thought it was the originators' right to determine
intent to publish, not Joe Public's? You're contradicting yourself.

No.  It was assumed that you are the originator - you said "my copyright"
You print several hundred copies of whatever, and distribute them randomly to
the public, in a methed which can't even remotely be construed as accidental,
then you are either demonstraing "intent to publish" or some form of insanity.

Joe Web Designer snaps and decides he hates his boss.  He removes the • firewall
protection, and posts a URL to the accounts receivable information.

Joe Hacker decides to have a little fun, and hacks around on foo.com until he
finds a hole through the firewall, or a password that gets him through the
incryption.  He pulls the information through, and turns foo.com into a • splash
page with next years product line.

Note that these both involve criminal actions, and thus are ineligible
as examples.

How so?  You wanted examples of how something could be on a webpage without the
author/company/whatever intending it to be there.  Illegal means are as valid
as any other.

Joe Web Designer mistypes a line in a script, and loads all the employee's
payroll information to the wrong server, and now it's on the www page.

Tough. Life sucks sometimes.

Life sucks != intent to publish.

But it doesn't really matter.  You're talking legalities - Yes, I agree, if
it's on the public side of a firewall, it's "legally" public.  But like I
said above, I don't care about the legalities of it, I'm talking about • politeness.

Again, politeness is not the issue here.

I think it is.  I don't think anyone here, Brad included, honestly believes
that LEGO would have a legal leg to stand on.  BUT claiming more legally than
one can necessarily enforce is a standard coporate tactic, and just about every
company in the world uses it.  The possibility prevents the bulk of
infractions, which is the point anyway.

James
http://www.shades-of-night.com/lego/



Message has 1 Reply:
  Re: Policy clarification regarding catalogs
 
(...) What do you mean "firewalls are on an unsecured webserver"? I think you need some more grounding in the terminology, cause I can't make head nor tail of what you're trying to say. If it should happen to be be "otherwise unsecured webserver (...) (25 years ago, 19-Dec-99, to lugnet.admin.general, lugnet.off-topic.debate)

Message is in Reply To:
  Re: Policy clarification regarding catalogs
 
(...) Gee. That's rather a cop-out, isn't it? (...) Yes, it does. (...) This is not about courtesy. At all. This is about a claim Brad made that it was _legally_ so. I am not saying it isn't impolite (though I don't agree..), I am saying it isn't (...) (25 years ago, 18-Dec-99, to lugnet.admin.general, lugnet.off-topic.debate)

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