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 Administrative / General / 3797
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Subject: 
Re: Policy clarification regarding catalogs
Newsgroups: 
lugnet.admin.general, lugnet.off-topic.debate
Date: 
Sat, 18 Dec 1999 06:18:02 GMT
Viewed: 
1237 times
  
In lugnet.admin.general, Jasper Janssen writes:
That's the same logic as "Anything in a store is for sale, that's what a
store is FOR."

Anything in a store _is_ for sale. Anything that isn't for sale isn't
_in_ the store, it's _a part of_ the store.

That's the only way for the analogy of the web to a store even to
remotely work.

Nope, it's not.  It's a very close analogy to what Jasper posted:
"Yes, it is. Anything on an unsecured webserver is being published."
Which you refute much more logically below.

No he doesn't. He agrees with me in every regard.

No, you're defining webserver differently.  I'm not going to bother quibbling
semantics with you.


As a real-life example, there is a directory on
<http:www.shades-of-night.com> that gets pictures and documents posted to it
to make them available to friends of ours who can't (for whatever reason)
receive them via e-mail.  Are they "published"?  No.

Yes. It's available via the webserver, in what is commonly known in
technical terms as "the public area".

No.  "in a place public can get to" != publically available != published.  The
three of them often co-incide, but do not necessarily do so.

Ask a judge.

Sorry, I don't have one handy.

As another example, what if I receive an e-mail from company X, because I'm a
loyal customer.  It gives me a code that I can enter on their website that
takes me to a "special offers" area where I can get a deal on product A.  The
information on the other side of that code could be linked directly by a URL,
but it certainly isn't meant to be publically available.

If it can, it's a very poorly designed website. I think you'll find it
can't in most cases. And, quite frankly, posting the link to such
would not constitute a breach of copyright. Reproducing the code,
OTOH, would.

Ah!  I see the problem here - you're arguing legalities.  I don't care two
hoots for the legalities of the issue, I'm talking common courtesy.

People keep citing Matthew's example of front window/back window.  I would be
inclined to say that it's more like peering over the fence.  I can do it,
nothing to prevent me, but that doesn't necessarily make it polite.

Certainly it is the originators right to determine "intent to publish", not
Joe Public.

Oh. So if I print a few hundred folders, crop-dust them over the inner
city, then say that everyone who's read it, or shown it to friends, or
given it away has violated my copyright because I didn't intend to
publish it, I have a leg to stand on?

You're being ridiculous - the analogy fails on several levels.  For one thing,
the actions you describe are intent to publish.

I could give other examples  as well, and I'm not even remotely an expert.

Probably equally easily disproved.

Joe Web Designer snaps and decides he hates his boss.  He removes the firewall
protection, and posts a URL to the accounts receivable information.

Joe Hacker decides to have a little fun, and hacks around on foo.com until he
finds a hole through the firewall, or a password that gets him through the
incryption.  He pulls the information through, and turns foo.com into a splash
page with next years product line.

Joe Web Designer mistypes a line in a script, and loads all the employee's
payroll information to the wrong server, and now it's on the www page.

But it doesn't really matter.  You're talking legalities - Yes, I agree, if
it's on the public side of a firewall, it's "legally" public.  But like I said
above, I don't care about the legalities of it, I'm talking about politeness.

James
http://www.shades-of-night.com/lego/



Message has 1 Reply:
  Re: Policy clarification regarding catalogs
 
(...) Gee. That's rather a cop-out, isn't it? (...) Yes, it does. (...) This is not about courtesy. At all. This is about a claim Brad made that it was _legally_ so. I am not saying it isn't impolite (though I don't agree..), I am saying it isn't (...) (25 years ago, 18-Dec-99, to lugnet.admin.general, lugnet.off-topic.debate)

Message is in Reply To:
  Re: Policy clarification regarding catalogs
 
(...) Anything in a store _is_ for sale. Anything that isn't for sale isn't _in_ the store, it's _a part of_ the store. That's the only way for the analogy of the web to a store even to remotely work. (...) No he doesn't. He agrees with me in every (...) (25 years ago, 18-Dec-99, to lugnet.admin.general, lugnet.off-topic.debate)

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