 | | Re: More on Palestine
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I think the bigger question is what is YOURS? I believe most people in here can see the difference between the WTC attack and a nation trying to end a protracted war (with an enemy that had proved time and time again that it would suicide, use (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) Okay... (...) Tell me, is this hogwash, straight from the Yitzhak Rabin Center for Israel Studies?: (URL)(I note you haven't answered whether you think it has a right to exist (...) Didn't I addressed that off-line with you? If not, obviously (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) So what's your definition of terrorism? ROSCO (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Anyone else think this is a bad idea?
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(...) Sticks and stones... Dan (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Anyone else think this is a bad idea?
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(...) <snipped> Sticks and stones...Everybody's entitled to an opinion. You see it your way, I see it mine, and I'm not concerned about your appraisal of my credibility. Dan (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) Really? What? If you mean the atomic explosions, you've got an awfully strange idea of the definition of terrorism. -- Tom Stangl ***(URL) Visual FAQ home ***(URL) Bay Area DSMs (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Violence created by presence of guns? (was: Gotta love Oracle...)
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(...) You're comparing vastly different countries, with different mindsets. Compare within a country, especially within the US, and you'll see that states that allow easy lawful access to guns tend to have lower violent crime rates. Compare apples (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Anyone else think this is a bad idea?
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(...) breaking down the proposition now: (...) "We should be aware of the advantage that modern liberal democracy derived from the spoils of empire..." (...) "followed by the past sixty years of broad based consumption..." (...) "that now means (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) This is more than a difference of opinion, so brushing it under the rug by calling it that won't work. (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) I don't think it's shameful for people to have differing opinions, so I guess we differ on that as well 8?) (...) No, no real surprise 8?) Our opinions diverge again. So be it. And I'd add that as far as the perpetrators of Sep 11 go, they (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) Larry, I might have missed it but given that Israel has a right to exist, what boundaries do you think it should have? The original partition boundaries, the current boundaries, the current boundaries with some concession to Palestinian (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) I'll discuss that if you like, but not whether using nukes in WW II was terrorism. It wasn't. (I again say shame on you for even suggesting it was). I just ran across this: (URL) it has some food for thought. I skimmed it quickly so I'm just (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) So I ask again, why not use the same weapons now? Are we not currently at war with a fanatical, evil emp^H^H^H group (or groups), and need to win? Is it not appropriate to use those weapons to win this war? Why / why not? ROSCO (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek misfires. The other reply is the one I meant, it's more fully formed. Frothier for your enjoyment, even... So don't reply to this one. Not sure why the first post took, it wasn't supposed to. (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) Really ROSCO, I should know better. You're just trying to spin me up as a diversionary tactic because, well, I don't know why you are doing it, except perhaps to divert attention from the thread topic? This exact debate has been held here (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) Really ROSCO, I should know better. You're just trying to spin me up as a diversionary tactic because, well, I don't know why you are doing it, except perhaps to divert attention from the thread topic? This exact debate has been held here (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) The allies were all fighting together. I dare say ANZAC didn't consult FDR on all movements involving US troops either. (...) The same old "it was war" excuse. Winning the war wasn't terrorism, dropping the bombs was. One was just a (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Anyone else think this is a bad idea?
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(...) Oh, and if you really truly are delusional enought to think all countries are equally bad, this REALLY ought to get you foaming. (URL) a defense of Berlusconi (who happened to be 100% correct when he said "We should be conscious of the (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) WE? That, I suspect, was the US's doing, and the US's alone, I don't think FDR consulted ANZAC. So you're off the hook. But please explain how it was terrorism, exactly, to win a war against an evil empire with less loss of life than a (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) You are going to have to do a little better than that at debunking... Is this quote "hogwash"? "Of course, "the right of Israel to exist" has never been accepted by its enemies, especially Yasser Arafat. " (I note you haven't answered whether (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Anyone else think this is a bad idea?
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(...) Because, warts and all, some countries are better, some are worse. Or do you really think that all countries are the same across the board, all are equally culpable? No matter HOW many examples of US malfeasance you post you are never ever (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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(...) after we committed against them 2 of the worst single acts of terrorism the world has known. ROSCO (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: More on Palestine
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For a moment, I couldn't tell whether I was reading something from the National Review or the World Zionist Org's website. What a bunch of hogwash. At least it was worth a good laugh. Dan (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Anyone else think this is a bad idea?
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(...) Why not? (...) Like I said, everybody has dirt under the nails. What about our CIA? What about Iran-Contra? What about us becoming pals with the Somolian warlords? What about us being pals with the Saudis, who are Wahabis just like the Taliban (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Violence created by presence of guns? (was: Gotta love Oracle...)
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(...) Statistics (...) *lawful* (...) Hmmm...I hate to point this out: UK murder rate by handgun is lower than US one...hmmm, seems that the _opposite_ effect is true. Or, look at Canada/US . Same sort of effects. Although, I think that it has a (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Violence created by presence of guns? (was: Gotta love Oracle...)
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(...) Simple - they go to areas where weapons are hard to *lawfully* get. Statistics prove this out - the easier it is to *lawfully* get a gun, hence the more *lawful* citizens have them, the lower the "bad" crimes in the area. (...) No, they often (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Something that tends to get forgotten I think is that just because all _government_ regulation is removed that there will be no regulation. I'm sure many, if not most, of the licenses which exist today would exist in a Libertopia. The (...) (23 years ago, 9-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) First, it proves the driver knows how to drive; second, it issues HIM the responsability for his actions behind the wheel, and noone else. It acts more to third parties' safety/insurance than the driver himself. (...) Synonym, PLEASE! :-) And (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Violence created by presence of guns? (was: Gotta love Oracle...)
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Tom Stangl writes: (snipped) (...) Most criminals aren't psychic, either. So how can they tell if someone is armed or not? They just try their luck. If the victim is not armed, fine; if it is, too bad, one person will (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Huh... does that mean only a few can decide my rights, if I belong to the mob? I disagree with you all the way. If more people want it, it is to be done. (...) (sorry, did not understand... please provide synonym. TIA) (...) Ah, yes. See (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) So if it is ultimately the driver's responsibility, what good then is the license or the act of issuing it? (...) There is no difference in kind among these. Both are abrogations of responsibility. I believe you are caught in a contradiction, (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) No. Might, or mob rule, does not make right. Rights must be paramount to the desires of the mob. I reject democracy when it is unfettered. The majority voting to deny even one single person rights, while democratic, is unjust. I prefer a (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) You have correctly interpreted my "No", Lar. "No, it does not", that was what I should have written. Language issues... :-) But you missed my point. The State grants the license, but the use the driver makes of it is his responsability. His (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Violence created by presence of guns? (was: Gotta love Oracle...)
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(...) Most criminals aren't stupid. Given a choice against going up against an armed or unarmed victim, most will logically choose the unarmed victim. I sure would if I were a criminal! -- | Tom Stangl, iPlanet Web Server Technical Support | Sun (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) (snipped) (...) If so many favor it, it can be right. The choice of the majority, right or wrong, is the one to follow. The basic principle of Democracy. (...) I dunno, I'll take your word for it. ;-) Pedro (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) (snipped) (...) ! (...) Yeah, right... (...) That is why mankind invented LANGUAGE... to express. A tool for expression is a pencil, a guitar, a toy, the body expression... A gun is a tool to *end* the need for speech. You shoot, you win, you (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Maybe some other time, this is a bit of a sidetrack. (...) Great, let's work to remove regulation where we both agree... (...) and when that deregulation happens, and people get used to the idea that regulations DON'T keep them safer than the (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Violence created by presence of guns? (was: Gotta love Oracle...)
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Hello Chris, (...) But wouldn't things be better when other means of expression are easier to get than arms? Or, still better than nothing, vice versa, when arms are harder to get? Of course, I don't want to advocate to NOT also tackle the root (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: PA censoring journalists again, but repudiating bin Laden...
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Hello Scott, (...) Because there are many Jews in the US, and because they have over-average positions with influence? Can it be as simple as that? Greetings Horst (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Hold your fire?
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Hello Larry, (...) 2, even though I am NOT sure whether it actually will work. But maybe we are lucky and the current path of 3 turns out to be 4 with less military effort ;-) Greetings Horst (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) You say "no", but you mean "yes". The state issued license in the example I gave did not prevent this driver from driving. Your assertion just proves my point, licenses do not prevent unsafe driving. (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Why? Isn't the beloved Constitution of the United States of America, plus ammendments, a compilation of general regulations? And isn't your freedom to criticize regulations DUE to regulations? :-) (...) Ok, what would you complement that (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) (snipped) (...) And what if you *don't* have a choice? (again, removed loc.pt) Pedro (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Road and rail should each be cut from subsidy. Chris (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Please state all the changes that WOULD make it safer. I don't think you're going to convince me that it would be safer without requiring licenses, even with the threat of lawsuits left and right. There are already too many people driving (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) No. The sense of the driver will. If he has lost sense, then he is likely to have lost the ability to drive as well. But two things can further complicate this: Not that many people reach that age, and I know someone who is 80 and keeps (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Freedom vs. Wellfare
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(...) I would *not* want to pay. He should pay for his own incarceration to the maximum extent possible, but when he cannot we must pay to keep him there in order to protect ourselves. (...) The child starves to death. (...) No they should not. But (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) In general, yes. (...) If that was the only change, yes. But I'm not advocating that one change alone, so no. (...) I can say yes to that question, because in general I am satisfied that regulations do not significantly lower risk, but rather, (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) You don't have to say hello each time, especially when you're saying hello to someone else than the post author. :-) (I wrote this one) (...) If you had a choice are you going to use the road that cares or the one that doesn't? You forget the (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Arguably, no. Not on a rights based calculus. But see Friedman (1) who argues that rights based calculus breaks down at the edges (asserting your right not to ingest one molecule of extra CO2 due to a car near but not on your property is a bit (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Fatwah
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(...) I had heard 1.0 B, or 1/5 (which is 1.2 and increasing I guess)... (...) (1) What do you (or, most especially, others) think of this: (URL) seems to be advancing a number of arguments that taken together say that islam is NOT peaceful, or at (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | More on Palestine
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Because this is an Israel Palestine thread now, I thought I'd toss this in: (URL) this (URL) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | News from the war
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(...) I would agree with that. However I expect the truth value of what the coalition says to be a bit higher (they will omit rather than lie, I would expect... not always, but much more than the Taleban) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Hey, everything has its drawbacks. Even horses pollute. For that matter, so do cyclists... -- Hop-Frog (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: PA censoring journalists again, but repudiating bin Laden...
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(...) I think this may be a bit of a stretch, Dan, and saying it isn't going to convince many people of the justness of your cause. By the way, I think I may have missed your answer to my question about the original UN resolution creating Israel. (I (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Hold your fire?
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Hello Larry, (...) I am equally undecided in my judgement of what is going on. ;-) The good news is: Four weeks after 911, there has been no overreaction. Instead, diplomatic pressure really seems to have had a significant effect. Enough to NOT (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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Hello Larry, you must be really opposed to ANY type of regulation, if this is the type of argument you use: (...) No regulation ever solves any problem 100% completely. But don't you think there would be a lot MORE unsafe drivers on the road WITHOUT (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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Hello Chris, (...) Why should they? They will probably make sure that whoever drives on them will be held liable for what he does to the road. But why should the road company care for other drivers? (...) Unless companies are shielded from their (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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| | Re: War
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Hello Scott, while I agree to some thoughts of your analysis, I have to oppose this one: (...) In no way does bin Laden or the Taliban stand for more freedom. Look at Iran and, even worse, Afghanistan. Only the leaders are enjoying freedom there. (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: War
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Hello Chris, (...) Making money is not one of your freedoms? Or you don't make money a the expense of the one worldwide environment we have? You pay fair prices for the goods you import from the third world? There are no people starving in Somalia, (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Anyone else think this is a bad idea?
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(...) You can't really mean that, can you? (...) Yes. Give the state sponsors of terrorism a seat too, that seems fair to me. ++Lar (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Freedom vs. Wellfare
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Hello Larry, (...) Now, this is exactly where we differ. While you seem to always look at the situation from the imprisoned father's perspective, I see the child to be an innocent victim of the father. And if you feel as a victim just because you (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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Hello Chris, (...) And you really feel more private then? They will even be able to know which types of products you buy. Theoretically. (...) Maybe it's different in the US, but here not everyone HAS a driver's license. I don't see much difference (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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Hello Chris, (...) I understand that this is the current situation. But why would you want to maintain it exactly this way? What makes driving different from bearing arms? Why is it acceptable to require permission for one but not the other? (...) (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Hold your fire?
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(...) Scott, I know of the work of Human Rights Watch, but who funds eurasianet? I couldn't find any references on their site. Thanks. There are dozens of tribes in the region and you can't tell who's doing what to whom without a detailed scorecard. (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: PA censoring journalists again, but repudiating bin Laden...
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(...) Really? I'd say a bunch of foreigners invading, terrorizing and running out the native population in the name of religion is pretty bad. Bulldozing those people's homes--pretty bad. Mortar attacks, helicopter gunship attacks, cluster bombs, (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Anyone else think this is a bad idea?
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Every country in the U.N. Secruity Council has dirt under the nails, Syria is no better or worse. Actually, having Syria there is may at least "balance the ticket" in a way. Syria has also been the victim of Israeli occupation so obviously Israel (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Anyone else think this is a bad idea?
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|
(URL) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: PA censoring journalists again, but repudiating bin Laden...
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(...) Come now Dan. If OBL did do this. And some Palestinians do support him. I think saying some Palestinians *resent* America is putting it lightly. (...) Israel is bad Dan. Israel is very bad. They are not quite as bad as the Taliban. Although it (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: PA censoring journalists again, but repudiating bin Laden...
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(...) <snipped> It's all one big, ugly mess. However, it comes as no surprise to me that some Palestinians, after years of American supported Israeli occupation and brutality, would praise Bin Laden. It would be different if America WAS actually (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: This is disgusting!...
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(...) Nope, Chris and I were talking about protecting *human rights*. You, in the text I quoted, are talking about protecting *your rights*. Scott A (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | independent collaboration (Re: PA censoring journalists again, but repudiating bin Laden...)
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Jarring title. When you said PA, I thought you meant the Press Asscoation: (URL) will be interesting what sort of news comes out of Afghanistan in the coming days. With so little independent collaboration on the ground (less than there was in Iraq) (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: This is disgusting!...
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(...) That would be me. No inconsistency there. Because, after all the whole triage thing only applies to nations that are causing major threats to materialise. Unlike Somalia for example. (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | PA censoring journalists again, but repudiating bin Laden...
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From (URL) start - The Palestinian Authority (news - web sites) also tried to quell expressions of support for the Saudi exile accused of leading the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks in the United States. In Gaza City, police fired tear gas, wielded clubs (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: This is disgusting!...
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(...) Hmm. So who said this: ==+== I have never supported foreign intervention for any reason other than a selfish one, to wit, that it was the only way to defend our own citizens at home. ==+== Scott A (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Hold your fire?
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(...) <snip good ref material> My point exactly. They're just different thugs, not necessarily *better* thugs. If I had 4 choices: 1. do nothing and hope for the best. 2. politicoeconomic campaign that causes the Taliban to eventually fall (as the (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: This is disgusting!...
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(...) Perhaps we owe them a little? (...) If you don't like a law you should work to change it, not ignore it. (...) How can we justify just looking at the easy problems? (...) I agree. (...) Should we not be ashamed that we have not helped before (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: War
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|
(...) I expect there are Rolls Royce’s too. (...) What is your wealth based on then? The 'wealth' of native Americans? The slave trade? (...) If Saudi-Arabia were to democratically vote for a Government which is "bad" (as Israel already has) then (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Looks like the attacks on Kabul have started
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(...) They did offer to work with us more if we showed the some evidence - a smart move on their part. We refused. It should have went to the UN. Instead we have ignored international law (as I understand it) and bombed them. Let's all hope the (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Hold your fire?
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(...) Read around Larry, they are little better. They are know to rape women in the towns they capture. More here: (URL) many Afghans are anxious to see an end to Taliban rule, they remain feaful about the prospect of a return of the Northern (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Fatwah
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(...) There are somewhere between 1.25 and 2.0 billion Muslims on the planet. I am lucky enough to know some of them. I read the sliver of text you quoted. I think about my experiences. I think about my understanding of Islam. Based on that alone I (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) The latter. If something has been incorrectly subsidised in the past the solution is not to jack up the subsidies of everything else you can find that remotely competes with it. Highways and airtransport have been unfairly subsidised in the (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Fatwah
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(...) I'm NOT sure, hence I asked. My hunch is that you can go rooting through the New Testament, or especially the Old Testament, and find similar passages. My hunch is that you can go through the Koran or OT or NT and find very peaceful passages (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Do you have the right to pollute by means of an automobile? :) Scott A (A Car owning cyclist) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Actually, we do have the right to travel by modern conveyance -- a right recognized under common law since the time of Magna Carta. Applying this argument to the a.k.a. "driving privilege" is not too complicated -- getting the courts to (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Looks like the attacks on Kabul have started
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Actually, I think he may have been somewhat sarcastic, as CNN has been doing live coverage since Sep. 11th. But that's just what I got from his post. (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: And you thought a national ID card was scary...
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Likely, only those passengers who take the "safe" flight would be ensured. The "unsafe" flights would quickly become a national security risk as any determined terrorist could take the "unsafe" plane and turn it into a missile. Oh, well, we knew (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Do you think Amtrak should get more than the $24B *subsidy* it has had since 1971, or do you think roads should get less *investment*? Scott A (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) What if? (...) No I don't. And those have to do (I believe) with children who are institutionally abused, more than with firearms. The firearm was a only tool...a means of expression. (...) say (...) Why is it that Europeans often start in (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Fatwah
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(...) What do you think? Are you even unsure? What is your hunch on this? Scott A (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | And you thought a national ID card was scary...
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Well, OK some of you didn't think is was *that* scary. Check this out: (URL) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Oh, I agree with you, totally! He SHOULD NOT be driving. So then... you concede that since the state nevertheless issued him a license, that licenses don't work to keep unsafe drivers off the road, right? That's what the example is (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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| | Re: 6776... Is this True?
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(...) Ummm, 8007, 8008?? They actually encourage you to buy both so the storm-trooper can shoot C3PO in the chest, and watch it's (OK it *is* a 'droid) head & arms get blown off. ROSCO (disclaimer: yes I own both, yes I think the mechanism is neat, (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Hold your fire?
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(...) The article seems a bit myopic, lacking in a historical perspective. The basically tribal societies of Afghanistan and indeed the five central Asian former Soviet states could continue see-sawing for centuries. The U.S. and Osama conflict (...) (23 years ago, 7-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Fatwah
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(...) I also dunno about the context thing, but further down in the article "Crusaders" are mentioned to be "terrorizing" the people living in Arabia. Obviously, it is an interpretation made by people who must think the 12th century isn't over yet (...) (23 years ago, 7-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) And what would it be done to prevent fraud, then? (...) So why not put a 5-year-old driving a Humvee, if his father can pay for the damage? As for the case of the old man, it is up to him and his family to provide alternatives - this way he (...) (23 years ago, 7-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) What if the permit is almost granted to be issued, unless one is declared "unfit"? (by a number of reasons, including possibly being a lunatic or a terrorist) (...) And then you get really shocked about stuff like Columbine, Waco, or that (...) (23 years ago, 7-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Horst Lehner writes: (Snipped) (...) Horst, I couldn't agree much more! Add "Portugal" to that paragraph, please... Pedro (23 years ago, 7-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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(...) Maybe... but then again, it is highly unlikely that any portuguese hasn't had ancestors of different races/ethnicites, thus noone can pick on me for that. Besides, names here are all alike, for all ethnicites. (...) Ah, fame... I can count (...) (23 years ago, 7-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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| | Fatwah
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(URL) hadn't read this before. I also haven't read the Koran (there seem to be many possible spellings of this, I've also seen Qu'urran, for example) But this quote from the beginning of the fatwah HAS to be taken out of context, right? "But when (...) (23 years ago, 7-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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