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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Horst Lehner writes:
> > Hello Larry,
> >
> > > > I have had a National ID card for ten years, and I only had to show it for
> > > > proof of identity on reasonable subjects: Tests (School, College
> > > > admission),
> > > > Licenses (Driver's and others), and as a login number (!) to know if I had
> > > > been admitted to College.
> > >
> > > See, that you think these reasonable is itself symptomatic.
> >
> > So, you think it would be OK to ...
> >
> > ... send someone else to a college test instead of showing up personally?
>
> No, this is a kind of fraud. But the fact that something is illegal is not a
> justification for every possible sort of remedy that any law enforcement
> officer can dream up. So while showing up for someone else's test IS fraud,
> it does not, in and of itself, justify a mandatory ID card as the only
> mechanism for preventing it.
And what would it be done to prevent fraud, then?
> > ... drive with someone else's driver's license?
>
> I see no reason for driver's licenses at all, in and of themselves. Rather,
> what should be provided on request is proof of liability coverage. Drivers
> licenses, just like any other minimum standard, only ensure that there are
> people that just barely make the minimum standard.
>
> Since in Florida, for example, an 89 year old person who barely passes the
> eyesight test and barely passes the "can you say your name" test can renew a
> previously held license for 6 years, during which they can go completely
> blind and completely senile...
So why not put a 5-year-old driving a Humvee, if his father can pay for the
damage?
As for the case of the old man, it is up to him and his family to provide
alternatives - this way he won't have to drive, someone will drive him.
Question of sense.
> So no, I don't see drivers licenses as any use for anything. If roads were
> private, I am sure that most road owners would require much more stringent
> proof of competence to operate on their roads than the state requires.
Or not. They would want as many people as possible to go through their roads
to pay toll; then would neglect maintenance to maximize profit. See the case
of the british railroads, and draw a paralell.
> This is an example of the general case assertion "regulations do not make
> you safer than a free market system, they make you less safe than a free
> market system"
Tell that to the millions of Russians who were left without their promised
pensions after years of hard work. I am pretty sure they curse free market
without social concerns (or regulations, from a different perspective). Note
that I don't support the previous regime, all I say is that the shock was
unbearable for the elderly.
> > > > Besides, our legislation FORBIDS the state agencies to cross data among
> > > > themselves (for instance, Social security record and Tax record), or to
> > > > share it with companies. There are a few laws about data collected from
> > > > citizens, very advanced indeed.
> > >
> > > Right, we have those too with respect to SSN. Didn't work.
> >
> > So, at least one thing works better in Europe than the US ;-)
>
> As far as you know, anyway. But you have less rights so you can't really be
> sure. (neither can we, of course)
Again, tell me ANY right I'd *benefit* from having (and I extend "I" to the
majority of the European population).
And what has that to do with that control device working or not?
Pedro
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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| (...) Oh, I agree with you, totally! He SHOULD NOT be driving. So then... you concede that since the state nevertheless issued him a license, that licenses don't work to keep unsafe drivers off the road, right? That's what the example is (...) (23 years ago, 8-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Gotta love Oracle...
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| (...) No, this is a kind of fraud. But the fact that something is illegal is not a justification for every possible sort of remedy that any law enforcement officer can dream up. So while showing up for someone else's test IS fraud, it does not, in (...) (23 years ago, 6-Oct-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.pt)
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