Subject:
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Macro-Evolution - Impossible!
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:53:41 GMT
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Viewed:
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289 times
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"Remember, the evidence the fossil record gives us is not about *how*
macroevolution happens, merely that it does." ++Lar
The fossil record as an evidence for macro-evolution has two aspects which must
be considered:
1) Do strata (layers of soil) support a progressive, over millennia, approach
which can reveal the progression of life through time? Or is there a better
explanation (hypothesis) which fits the evidence?
2) Does the fossil record support macro-evolution as a mechanism - survival of
the fittest, a life-form progression producing creatures better fit to survive?
I posit that these are the key questions which need to be addressed.
I will address them one at a time, unless there is any dispute.
I would submit, though, that without an explanation for abiogenisis - another
tenant of evolutionary theory, there is nothing for the macro-evolution process
to work on, and that, more fundamental, question should logically be addressed
first.
-Jon
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Message has 3 Replies: ![](/news/x.gif) | | Re: Macro-Evolution - Impossible!
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| Jon and Bruce are exasperating each other without getting very far, so I thought I'd go back to the beginning of the thread and look at Jon's original statements. I may be falling into his trap, that's OK. I've done it to him before so I guess it's (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
| ![](/news/x.gif) | | Re: Macro-Evolution - Impossible!
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| On the subject of Macro evolution: I present the following excerpt (again from (URL) understand, when I talk about evolution I am not referring to simple variations that occur in any species. Dogs produce a variety of puppies, but never will dogs (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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78 Messages in This Thread: ![You are here](/news/here.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Bruce Schlickbernd (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Jonathan Lill (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Bruce Schlickbernd (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Jon Kozan (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Dave Schuler (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Jon Kozan (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Dave Schuler (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Jon Kozan (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tim Culberson (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jon Kozan (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Dave Schuler (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tim Culberson (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jon Kozan (24-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/268.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Bruce Schlickbernd (24-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Christopher Tracey (24-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Dave Schuler (24-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jon Kozan (24-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Dave Schuler (24-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Credibility... (Was: Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!")) -David Eaton (24-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Credibility... (Was: Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!")) -Jon Kozan (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Credibility... (Was: Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!")) -Tom Stangl (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Credibility... (Was: Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!")) -David Eaton (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Credibility... (Was: Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!")) -Frank Filz (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Credibility... (Was: Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!")) -David Eaton (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Credibility... (Was: Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!")) -Erik Olson (27-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Credibility... (Was: Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!")) -Frank Filz (27-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.people)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Creditability... -Erik Olson (27-Jan-01 to lugnet.people)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Creditability... -Frank Filz (27-Jan-01 to lugnet.people)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jennifer Clark (24-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Dave Schuler (24-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/268.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tim Culberson (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jennifer Clark (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tim Culberson (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Guy Albertelli (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tim Culberson (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Its Own Worst Enemy (was Re: Support for Creationism ) -Dave Schuler (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tom Stangl (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jennifer Clark (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tim Culberson (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jennifer Clark (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/268.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jon Kozan (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -James Brown (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jennifer Clark (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jon Kozan (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jennifer Clark (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Larry Pieniazek (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jennifer Clark (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Hubris -Dave Schuler (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Hubris -Jennifer Clark (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.fun)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Hubris -Dave Schuler (26-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.fun)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Hubris -Jennifer Clark (28-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.fun)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tim Culberson (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Dave Schuler (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tim Culberson (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Larry Pieniazek (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Tim Culberson (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -James Brown (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Larry Pieniazek (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Scott Arthur (27-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/246.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Larry Pieniazek (27-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Jennifer Clark (29-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Support for Creationism (was Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!") -Scott Arthur (29-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Bruce Schlickbernd (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Jon Kozan (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Bruce Schlickbernd (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Jon Kozan (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Bruce Schlickbernd (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Jon Kozan (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/28.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/68.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - "Impossible!" -Jon Kozan (22-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
![](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/268.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - Impossible! -Larry Pieniazek (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - Impossible! -Jon Kozan (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - Impossible! -Larry Pieniazek (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - Impossible! -Jon Kozan (23-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - Impossible! -Dave Low (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - Impossible! -Tim Culberson (25-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif) ![](/news/46.gif) ![Re: Macro-Evolution - Impossible! -Lindsay Frederick Braun (30-Jan-01 to lugnet.off-topic.debate)](/news/x.gif)
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