Subject:
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Re: Whatever happened... LETS end this.....
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lugnet.org.ca.rtltoronto
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Date:
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Wed, 22 Dec 2004 03:42:03 GMT
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In lugnet.org.ca.rtltoronto, Chris Magno wrote:
> if anyone has a way of bringing back the good ol days let me know
[snip]
There is so much interesting discussion in this thread, I couldn't decide
which post I wanted to reply to most. But I picked this one because of this
one phrase.
I often find that while sitting in front of the PC to respond to a post, I
can't think of anything particularly helpful. But while away from it and
thinking about other completely different things (like what that marshmallow
I dropped behind the fridge a few months ago probably looks like by now), I
come up with all kinds of great thoughts..., at least I think they are. ;]
This one was: "LUGNET." As in "LEGO Users Group Network."
*USERS*
The other comments/suggestions here about more MOC postings, a MOC highlight
system separate from post highlights, etc., are all driving at the same theme:
bring back LUGNET being for LEGO *users*, and helping those users network
with each other.
Okay, so I set that point aside for a moment while going back to another
theory I've heard somewhere or other related to something or other, but it
came from a very wise man: you don't need to make one big change to get the
effect you desire. By simply make lots of small changes, all in the desirable
direction, you'll inevitably change the whole for the better. Don't focus
on obtaining the perfect solution to all the problems all in one shot. Instead
work at little things and keep adding little things and things will evolve in
the direction you wish.
So, what are some of the little ideas we have so far, or that I can offer?
How's about:
1. More MOC posts---We can all do that.
2. A MOC rating system on LUGNET---It's been put out there, just light a fire
under someone's @ss to get it going. :]
3. Don't be silent---Dave K's advice. Good idea. I used to ignore things as
well. Sometimes it allows things to fizzle (like trolls). Unfortunately,
other things need to be put down, hard. Okay, that's excessive, but you have
to offer some kind of resistance to activity you disagree with. And if it's
an important enough issue to the core of LUGNET, hey, stow the sugar-coating
and hammer people on it. It doesn't mean you'll always "win", but at least
lurkers will see more than one side! Or something like such.
4. Disband certain .Market newsgroups---Okay, this one I came up with. Think
about the "status" of the AFOL world back when LUGNET was created (it's been
described well in this thread), and think about the various perceived
networking "needs" of AFOLs back then. Where to buy sets? Where to find
good deals? Swapping/trading of sets/parts? Help finding old sets to buy?
Etc. Now, as mentioned by some of you, eBay, Brickbay, etc., changed many
things. Well something they have changed is they've almost by default removed
the need to maintain certain newsgroups. For examples:
- .market.appraisal---Burn it. It's hardly used anyway, and it's only real
use is to assess theoretical market values of sets. At one time we found that
useful. But now eBay, Bricklink, etc., provide all the info by default. This
newsgroup is now more suitable for speculators than for *Users*.
- .market.auctions---Burn it. Auction sites exist elsewhere, and I doubt
anyone has run a do-it-yourself auction in a long time. Let's make LUGNET
about using LEGO, not the LEGO marketplace.
- .market.BrickShops---Burn it. I'm pretty sure we all know how to find
Bricklink, etc., by now. Maintaining the links somewhere on the site is
adequate.
- .market.BST---The "trade" part could be useful. But buy/sell? You could
make an argument for keeping this, but establishing some norms for conduct.
For example, no brickshop sales, no auctions, no retail sales, etc. Stricty
user-to-user transactions. It'll be pretty easy for any of us frequenting
that group to tell the difference between someone doing casual buy/sell and
someone trying to run "business" through there. Stomp 'em when they do.
- .market.Jambalaya---Keep it! I have no idea if people still do these
things but this was one of the original, fun, and *non-commercial* trading
mechanisms. Revive it!
- .market.services---Burn it. It has far too much to do with conducting a
brickshop.
- .market.shipping---Burn it. See previous.
- .market.shopping---Arguable, burn it. I think we are all well-connected
enough by now that we know how to find retail LEGO deals. But newbies may
not, and when I was a newbie many moons ago I found this to be a very useful
service. Could keep it, but again, let's "police it" as users to establish
the norm of what's acceptable there, and what isn't. Local sales: great.
S@H specials: awesome. Brickshop ads: gut 'em. :]
- .market.theory---Occasionally things get FUT'ed here, but then nobody
follows-up. I put some stuff in there about how much LEGO can be stuffed into
the PaB bags, because I couldn't think of where else to put it. Shopping would
probably suffice though. Otherwise, everything else to .theory is mostly
more useful to speculators than users. Ergo, burn it.
- SUMMARY for .market---It's reduced to simply .BST, .shopping, and .jambalaya.
Thus this aspect of LUGNET returns to its original intent, that of helping
LEGO users network to find LEGO sets and bits. All other needs are met by
other sites such at Bricklink, etc. Archive the burnt groups as a link for
historical reference if anyone cares.
5. Okay, I typed so much for #4 that I forgot the other ideas!
6. Meh, what the hell, while I'm on the soapbox: .people---burn it. Burn
it down, and salt the earth. :] But this one was already tore apart in
recent months, with Todd et.al. saying this stuff stays. It's something I
disagree with personally, but whatever. At the very least, the saving grace
seems to be that those groups are quite self-contained and thus "low-profile"
around the rest of LUGNET (aside from when some were created recently).
Because of this, you can argue (and it was) that they don't really bother
much. Okay then...
7. Combination of the above points---make it clear in our posts that LUGNET
is about Users of LEGO, not speculators, etc. Hey, I'm a collector too, and
I've used buy and sell to my advantage to build a bigger collection. But I'm
not a speculator, and I certainly don't harrass TLC on their decisions because
I largely couldn't give a fat crap. That's where the line is. After shutting
down the non-user-helpful .market groups, and each of us making our presence
felt very strongly as *users*, I think the people tending too far into that
unproductive territory will either wise up of their own accord, or they'll
just pi$$ off to elsewhere. Either way, we can make groups like .LEGO
productive again!
Anyhow, these are just starts. Absolutely none of the above ideas can't be
implemented immediately. Does it fix everything? No. Does it "bring back
the good ole days"? Not immediately. But it's a start on some small changes,
enough of which will get us there eventually.
To the rtlto posters, I would offer the additional poke: quit freakin' hiding
in this group!! Okay, keep all your non-sensical banter here :] but put
the on-topic stuff in the proper on-topic groups to help seed those groups
with useful topics to everyone. It may have become convenient to just post
everything here in this group, but it's not being terribly helpful to LUGNETs
state to hide in here. Like Dave K says, ya gotta speak up. Half the time
I feel like I'm one of the only people left who still respects the newsgroup
charters as best I can. Maybe it is true that LUGNET has too much
compartmentalization..., but as I suggest for the .market groups, each of these
can be revisited at any time to match the needs of LEGO *users* today, not
what they might have been in the past.
Anyhow, my final request is that people don't get roped into debating these
ideas, trying to tweak them until they're perfect. Instead, just frickin'
start acting on them! They can be tweaked as we go along, once we see
how they work out. This puts some of the action items squarely onto the
Admins, so Todd or whoever the heck it is that still pushes the buttons
around here now, get on it! :] Hey Lar, since you read every post once and
reply twice ;] I know you're reading this, so help get us an answer on the
above ideas that require Admin action. How about we get an answer on the
trimmed .market heirarchy by the New Year?
Off to find that marshmallow now...
KDJ
_____________
LUGNETer #203
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Message has 2 Replies:
 | | Re: Whatever happened... LETS end this.....
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| (...) WOW, look at me... adding up the post count. since i asked for the ideas I guess i should start off by saying thanks. (...) 1. the marshmallow is gone. the cat at it. (...) you are correct, BUT one teeny tiny point is that this is NOT just (...) (20 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.org.ca.rtltoronto)
| | | Re: Whatever happened... LETS end this.....
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| (...) Ouch. (...) I'll give you an answer right now, how's that. As I understand it (remember I ain't the techie here, just the gadfly) the technology to archive a group exists. The group itself doesn't go away, it's just not visible any more, stuff (...) (20 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.org.ca.rtltoronto)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Whatever happened... LETS end this.....
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| (...) OK, i haven't even made it through this thread, and I'm I'm.... I'm something.... mad, bored, angry, lethargic.... all of the above. I was NOT going to say this in public.... but now I will. WE ~HAVE~ JUMPED THE SHARK!!!! PERIOD! END OF (...) (20 years ago, 21-Dec-04, to lugnet.org.ca.rtltoronto)
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