Subject:
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Re: Reagan... not exactly libertarian, but close
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 3 Apr 2000 01:55:08 GMT
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Viewed:
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388 times
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> > >
> > > Again, the point of that spectrum is that current left liberals are OK • on
> > > personal freedom (factoring out minor PCness) but lousy on economic. • current
> > > right conservatives are are OK on economic freedom but lousy on personal • (freedom).
> > >
> > > ++Lar
> >
> > I profoundly disagree. It is liberals who are anti-freedom.
>
> You're not clearly distinguishing betweeen personal and economic freedom, • so
> you fall into the one dimensional trap.
Well, it really depends on what you would consider personal freedom. Should
the government be involved in things? No. Look at the census, for example.
What time do you go to work and what time d you come back. What, are they
trying to set up dates for Bill when he leaves office? I think the major
issue regarding most of these issues is what scope does the government have?
I do think left-liberals are anti-freedom, in both economic and personal
issues.
> > Liberals are the
> > ones trying to tax and regulate anything that moves. You are confusing • freedom
> > and morality again.
>
> No I'm not.
>
> Take the quiz.
>
> > Abortion, homosexuality, drugs etc. are not matters of
> > freedom but BASIC morality. All of these things are demonstrably
destructive.
It really depends on the individual. I know some homosexual couples that
last longer than heterosexual couples. Clearly, the bible states what
homosexuality is to God (Do we need to start debating whether it is viable
or not? ) I think some Christians really overblow this issue. A sin is a sin
is a sin to God. We all sin, and homosexuals are no different. I really
don't care what people do in their bedroom that is their business. I know
what God says about it, and you will never convince me otherwise. However,
do what you want, as long as you are not infringing on people's rights. Most
people do not like homosexuality. It is a very touchy issue, and one that
the government should not be involved in. I think Christians need to stay
true to their principles, and not expect the governmnet to enforce bad
behavior. I think the government does advocate destructive behavior.
> 2 points.
>
> a) no they're not
>
> I vehemently dispute that homosexuality is in and of itself destructive.
As do I, from a worldy perspective. From a Christian perspective, like other
sins, it can be spiritally destructive.
> I vehemently dispute that all drugs are destructive. Even all recreational
> drugs, since clearly you're not arguing that penicillin is destructive.
Well, since my fiancee is going to be a pharmacist, I have some interesting
viewpoints on this. Pharmacists are one of the most regulated professions I
have ever seen. I looked through her law class (Yes, you have to take 2
semesters of a law class to be a pharmasist!) and it is a joke. Some people
use illegial drugs responsibly, some don't. Some use legal drugs
responsibly, some don't. Seeing a bunch of pharm students at the class of
2001 at Ferris State get drunk makes me shake my head and I was glad there
is a bus ready to shuttle them back, because they were getting so drunk.
Seeing what they are doing to tabacco, Larry, what do think the government
will do if they do legalize illegial drugs? I can see the same things
happening. I can't wait for the fat tax to start appearing at fast food
places (especially since I ate at BK tonight!)
The drug war has problems, but so do a lot of things the government does. I
don't see things happening that will change much of the government right
now.
> Abortion... I just don't even want to discuss that. No common basis as • long as
> you believe that life begins at conception. DON'T respond, there's nothing • to
> say.
Hmm... for someone who likes to hear himself talk, Larry, that is a strange
statement. The bible says that life starts at conception, if you wonder why
Christians feel the way they do about abortion. I think the abortion issue
should be handled more along the lines of personal responsibility. There are
a lot of issues on this.
> b) so what if they are, as long as you're the only person harmed.
Indeed. But both do affect other people sometimes, so if it does not hurt
other people, fine. If it does, then it is another matter.
> Set society up so this is the case and you won't need to legislate
morality.
Well, one could argue that government does legislate morality on both the
right and the left. Class warfare is one of the biggest issues for the left,
lusting after other peoples money, rather than having a fair tax system.
Atheism is a religion all its own, and is used a lot in various issues, like
school choice and the like. If the government is truly nuetral, then I think
you will find a lot more Christians supporting Libertarian causes. The way I
see it now, no.
> Your brand of conservatism does legislate morality, and therefore i reject
it.
I reject the left's morality, and I reject that also. Government should get
out of our lives, both for Christians and others.
Scott S.
Scott E. Sanburn
Systems Administrator-Affiliated Engineers -> http://www.aeieng.com
LEGO Page -> http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Station/3372/legoindex.html
Coming Soon: The Sanburn Systems Company
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Message is in Reply To:
 | | Re: Reagan... not exactly libertarian, but close
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| (...) You're not clearly distinguishing betweeen personal and economic freedom, so you fall into the one dimensional trap. (...) No I'm not. Take the quiz. (...) 2 points. a) no they're not I vehemently dispute that homosexuality is in and of itself (...) (25 years ago, 1-Apr-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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