Subject:
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Re: "France is not a Western Country anymore"
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Sun, 20 Apr 2003 03:37:09 GMT
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Viewed:
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605 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Richard Marchetti writes:
>
> > Show me with the use of facts how we don't have some crazy neo-conservative
> > empire in the works and I just may listen to you.
> What you are asking for is akin to me asking you to prove that God doesn't
> exist.
Careful--in principle, God's nonexistence can be proven simply by
demonstrating a logical contradiction in his essential nature. Of course, the
faithful are generally willing to accept any number of logical contradictions
in order to preserve the underlying faith, but that's another matter.
By this token, you could easily answer Richard's challenge by demonstrating
the logical possiblity of his assertion (ie, that our blossoming
neo-conservative empire does NOT in fact exist). It is false and fallacious to
claim that his demand is impossible.
> The facts that you are providing are not causal, but more like
> coincidental, and certainly not evidence of conspiratorial.
A few weeks ago I pointed out that it is Conservatives who invariably beat the
drum of conspiracy, always claiming that liberals are the ones citing
conspiracy. Here's a fine example of my point: you are pretending (via a straw
man paraphrase) that Richard is claiming conspiracy, but he is not. It is
false and fallacious of you to do so. Next, you'll probably bring up "class
warfare" and blame the Left for invoking it...
> I can't prove to you that conspiracies don't exist anymore then you can prove
> they do, at least with the paltry amount of circumstantial evidence you are
> able to provide.
Again with the conspiracy. Perhaps you could refocus on the argument and
address the conflict of interest inherent in having two (actually, more than
two) Big Oil Men in the White House to decide oil and energy policy. It
doesn't matter that they are no longer officially linked to their respective
companies; the fact that they made millions in the industry creates an
insoluble conflict of interest.
> Now, if I were to believe in a conspiracy, I'd wonder why the connections
> between Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols and Muslim terrorists wasn't fully
> investigated by our government.
I've heard that point elsewhere, and it's tangential but interesting. The
apparent primary motivation for refusing to investigate those connections is to
maintain the facade of national security. That is, if the FBI admits that it
allowed al Qaeda or Hussein to exert influence on US soil, that's tantamount to
the FBI admiting failure in its most basic duty.
It sounds like you're implying something fishy about the Clinton
administration. But even if you're not, then you should probably question why
the current FBI hasn't explored connections between the antrax mailings and al
Qaeda activity, or why the Saudi-friendly administration hasn't explored the
Saudi connection to al Qaeda at all.
Dave!
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: "France is not a Western Country anymore"
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| I think I like where Dave! is going with this stuff -- and again, this liberal stance doesn't respect parties: w oppose corruption, cronyism, and stupidity in matters domestic and foreign irrespective of which party is involved. Right now, we are (...) (22 years ago, 20-Apr-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: "France is not a Western Country anymore"
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| (...) What you are asking for is akin to me asking you to prove that God doesn't exist. The facts that you are providing are not causal, but more like coincidental, and certainly not evidence of conspiratorial. Bechtel got some contracts. Fine. And (...) (22 years ago, 19-Apr-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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