 | | [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | I had an idea about how to frustrate snipers on eBay. I don't think I'm the first person to come up with this idea, but it hasn't been discussed much. eBay allows the seller to end the auction early. What if I, as a seller, made a clear announcement (...) (25 years ago, 23-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | (canceled) —Todd Lehman
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| | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Mitchell I. Puschett
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| | | | Instead, put a note in the auction text that you reserve the right not to honor any bid placed in the last X minutes unless placed by a previous bidder in the same auction. You might also offer the established high-bidder - the person who was in the (...) (25 years ago, 26-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | (...) Awesome idea! I think this is better than closing the auction unexpectedly. I did not know eBay allowed that. Might get negative feedback from your sniper, but you can very well reply to it clarifying that you did what you said you would. (25 years ago, 26-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —John DiRienzo
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| | | | | | Hi Lego auction enthusiasts, I want to give this idea below some consideration. I had an auction end last night where the bidder who had the high bid for five days was outbid with forty seconds remaining. Needless to say, he was upset, and said he (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | | (...) Was this on your mondo set of lots that all ended at the same time? Guess that it didn't prevent sniping (of one lot) after all. Bummer. my condolences to the snipee. Another idea along these lines is to announce in the setup that any and all (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Rose Regner
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| | | | | | | | (...) I do!!! If you say something goes off sale and remove it before I get a chance to bid (or snipe), you will get negative feedback. I think most any buyer on e-bay will agree. Sometimes I see when an item goes off, and then try to log on when I (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | | | (...) We've been through that, it doesn't hold up when there are multiple auctions being run simultaneously, read old messages for more details. (...) Why? I complain about my government, but I use it anyway. Not like I have a choice, or anything. A (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Rose Regner
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| | | | | | | | | | | (...) True: Then complain about e-bay to someone who can change it... e-bay!!! (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Rose Regner
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| | | | | | | | | | (...) You know, even live auctions can have "snipers". Steve, I am sorry I struck a nerve with you. I certainly just added my $0.02 to the mix. I did not realize you were so very passionate about e-bay. Unlike the government, or more importantly the (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | | | | | (...) My definition of 'sniper' is someone who places a bid so near to the close of a fixed-ending auction that other bidders cannot respond to the new bid, even if they want to. In live auctions, you always have the choice to rebid. Or not. (...) (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Rose Regner
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Last post, I promise..... I guess I cannot see how my theories have been proven false in prior postings. I am not trying to start a war of words. I would just like to understand where the problem is. Are you opposed to how e-bay fixed-end auctions (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (canceled) —James Brown
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —James Brown
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) Don't, please. If this is your last post, then discussion stops, and people start posting auction announcements here again <duck and cover> ;-) (...) Here is an argument (of mine) pulled from a previous thread. It shows one (of many) of the (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Rose Regner
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) people (...) (of (...) often (...) with (...) looking (...) bid (...) able (...) could (...) I understand the dilemma, but just because you may want 2 different items and have a fixed maximum, and I only want one and have the same amount to (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —James Brown
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) I never claimed other bidders (or you) were the bad buy. Nor does this example by itself, I admit, make e-bay bad(1). It does, however, illustrate a flaw in a fixed-ending auction, in that it means a buyer goes away unhappy, and with money (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) Like the fact that I just this morning received a "daily eBay update" which was two days stale? It listed my auction (which closed two days ago), with an old high-bid? And I still haven't received the auction-closing confirmation e-mail from (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Todd Lehman
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) What's the outgoing datestamp from the originating SMTP mailserver? Maybe the message was just tied up in SMTP congestion (which isn't that uncommon). --Todd (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) I'll have to look. BTW, just this morning I received the end-of-auction message. Steve (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Todd Lehman
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) And *this* makes eBay bad, IMO. --Todd (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Todd Lehman
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) It's a very common thing. (...) You're dreaming! Why should people be forced to do this? Bidding on multiple things in multiple auctions on a tight budget is the norm, not the exception. (...) The set at the store wasn't going to go away if it (...) (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Todd Lehman
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) It certainly is... Well said! (...) That's an awesome way to explain it! (...) Ditto on that. (...) Yes! Yes! (...) Touche! --Todd (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) I've made promises like that before. Steve (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Todd Lehman
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | (...) Primarily the buyer. (...) This may be true a very small portion of the time, but in general it is false. (...) Exactly. Which is why the concept of a "maximum you'd be willing to pay" is a silly concept. (...) Then 95% of buyers are your (...) (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | | | | | | | | | (...) Not if you've been shot. Snipers can ruin your whole day. (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | | | | | | (...) Where's that QOTD newsgroup? Steve (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | | | | | | | (...) Technically, the IRS and other elements of governmental intrusion are choices as well. There are a number of measures that people take to avoid paying the IRS and complying with governmental regulation. (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | | | (...) Go ahead. And realise that your feedback will be responded to, pointing out that the auction was run in compliance with the rules as they were stated in the auction listing. So it won't count for much, I don't think. If we devise a way to (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | | | | | (...) But who takes the time to read those responses? Mostly folks just check the number and if it's low maybe they go look at it. If you did this enough, and you received enough negative feedback, it could hose your rating which might end up being (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Martin Legault
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| | | | | | | (...) <snip> If he was willing to pay 50$ more wy didn't he put his proxy 50$ more in the first place? By snipping at the end of an auction give you the chance of winning the bid for lest money. Bidder A put a bid of 50$ with proxy of 100$ 3 day (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | | | | (...) This has been discussed in detail before. Several dozen appends right here in this very group debunk this line of reasoning, at least for a significant fraction of buyers. You might want to review that rather than repeating the same argument (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Mike Poindexter
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| | | | | | | | | | Larry, I realize that this has been hashed out before, but I must put this in: The reason that it doesn't work is that you don't know how much you have to spend until the auctions close and whether or not you bought something and drained your bank (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —James Brown
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| | | | | | | | | | (...) No, no, no, and a thousand times no! People (in general) know how much they have to spend. My budgets are typically worked out well in advance, and most adults have some sort of budget plan, or they quickly go in debt (much like goverments). (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Mike Poindexter
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| | | | | | | | | | James, If an auction runs too long, people will lose interest in it. I speak from a sample size of 1 - me. I would chose shorter auctions as opposed to longer ones. I do not represent the entire population, but 1 segment. If the system (eBay's)is (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | | | | | (...) OK. G1/G2/Sold auctions can run as long - or as short - as the seller wants (assuming the auction site allows). If the seller wants to increase the 'excitement factor' by keeping the auction shorter, they can: 1. Decrease the time from the (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Mike Stanley
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| | | | | | | | | | (...) For the (off-topic) record, I've paid for Linux, OS/2, and Lotus software. In fact, I'm probably going to order Caldera next week and give their new version a shot. (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Todd Lehman
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| | | | | | | | (...) Maybe he didn't know that he was willing to bid that high when it started. --Todd (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Rose Regner
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| | | | | | -----Original Message----- From: John DiRienzo <jdiri14897@email.msn.com> Newsgroups: lugnet.market.auction Date: Tuesday, April 27, 1999 12:33 AM Subject: Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? (...) STOP WHINING! If your buyer was willing to pay $50 above (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | (...) Intelligent adults don't abuse exclamation marks. Try again. Steve (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Rose Regner
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| | | | | | | | Steve Bliss wrote in message <3725ea01.338184973@...et.com>... (...) Sorry!!!...!!! (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | | | | Eric, It appears that you have an overly-strong emotional attachment to this issue. It might be a good idea to step back, take a breather, and avoid being rude. As an "intelligent adult" you should be able to handle this kind of disagreement without (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Rose Regner
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| | | | | | | | Sorry 'bout the tone. It was not aimed at anyone inparticular, but at the buyer who says he would have gone $50 more. I just feel that complaining about a wrong decision, and blaming it on someone else (e-bay) is silly! Consumers have choices, and (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Planning, not arguments, please (was Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | | | (...) I'll reiterate my position on this. Some people like eBay (not e-bay, by the way) and some don't. This particular thread is NOT supposed to be a general defense of eBay. It is NOT supposed to be an explanation of why eBay is flawed, either. (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: Planning, not arguments, please (was Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Mitchell I. Puschett
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| | | | | | | | (...) eBay states on page: (URL) You may ... cancel bids placed in your auction, (...) Invalidating bids based on when they were placed seems to fall under "legitimate" and "valid" if the rules of the auction were clearly defined beforehand. (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: Planning, not arguments, please (was Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —John DiRienzo
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| | | | | | | | Mitchell I. Puschett wrote in message <37268F52.E2AFDA8D@pol.net>... (...) Thanks for getting back onto the topic I was interested in... (...) This is interesting to me. However, I think these rules are out dated. Since eBay recently changed the (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: Planning, not arguments, please (was Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Mitchell I. Puschett
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| | | | | | | | | (...) The valid counter-argument is that if the sniper followed the rules of this particular auction, the problem would not have occurred. As in a sport, rules are present to encourage a fair match. Occasionally, a trivial violation leads to a (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: Planning, not arguments, please (was Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | | (...) He should have read the rules of the auction. Several messages have stated that the auction announcement should and must include a description of how the auction is going to differ from a regular eBay auction. Bidders should always read (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: Planning, not arguments, please (was Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —John DiRienzo
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| | | | | | | | Steve Bliss wrote in message <37271966.8425450@lu...et.com>... (...) The rules, if clearly stated, should not be arguable, although they still will upset some snipers. Funny - yes, thats true, but the actual motive is to give the rightful (or (...) (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: Planning, not arguments, please (was Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | | | (...) Good questions. Bidders who don't look at all postings would be the biggest problem. eBay won't do a darn thing--we'd be working entirely within the rules. We *would* be risking getting negative feedback. requoting: (...) Which points out (...) (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Mitchell I. Puschett
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| | | | | | (...) I think you are assuming that consumers are more rational then they actually are. If you carry your assumption to it's extreme, ebay should not need to keep track and publish the current high bid and bidder of an auction in progress. Each (...) (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | (...) Very nicely said. Steve (25 years ago, 28-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | Interesting. Except I'd rather not void an otherwise valid-bid. And I don't care if newcomer enters late in the game. They just have to be able to hold the bid for the X minutes required before I close the auction. Basically, I think the auction (...) (25 years ago, 26-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | (...) What if bidding is perking along at a rate just short of lasting long enough to close down, and you run off the end of the time period? Whoever has it then wins. Back to where you were before. Snipers still can win. (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —John Matthews
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| | | | | | | What is so bad about sniping? I don't think I have ever done it, but I'm not sure I completely understand it. Is it like driving in the left lane that you know is going to be closed in a half mile but you drive that lane anyway and dodge in at the (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | | | (...) Yes, but worse. But we digress. (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —John Neal
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| | | | | | | | Whoa, hold on there, pardner! I don't know if I'd equate the two! You could just shoot someone who drives like that;-) As far as sniping goes, I have come in late on occasion and put in last minute bids but the difference was that, sometimes, the (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Todd Lehman
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| | | | | | | | (...) I'm sure that'll do wonders for trust. :) --Todd (25 years ago, 29-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | | | (...) This is a problem in my idea, but I don't think it would actually come into play in real life. I'm assuming X is relatively short, like 5-10 minutes. But even if it is relatively long, like 1-2 hours, I wouldn't expect that bidders could keep (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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| | | | | | Re: [DISC] Shortcircuit eBay? —Steve Bliss
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| | | | One other thing -- the 'established high-bidder' approach requires the seller to analyze and know who is the 'established high-bidder'. In most auctions, this wouldn't be a problem. Just check once a day, and see who's got the item. But if there was (...) (25 years ago, 27-Apr-99, to lugnet.market.auction)
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