Subject:
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Re: "Peace" can be dangerous (was: Re: Peruvian Indians [Re: ..)
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 2 Sep 2002 08:49:05 GMT
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Viewed:
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988 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur writes:
> > > > What do you mean? Isn't that the goal? The only goal? Isn't saving lives
> > > > the whole reason for concern? I hope it's not just about retribution for >you.
> > >
> > > My point is that *any* amount of terrorism is unacceptable.
> >
> > One man's terrorist is an other man's partisan. Marek Edelman was one of the
> > leaders of the Warsaw ghetto uprising of the Jews against the Nazis in 1943.
> > Is he a terrorist or a freedom fighter? Should his living relatives be
> > punished for his actions?
>
> Irrelevant.
lol. I thought you'd say that. I think it is relevant.
> I reject your comparison of Nazi Germany's occupation and
> Israel's, and am rather offended by it.
I thought you'd say that too. But the truth is Mr Edelman probably knows
more ablout the subject than either you or I. This is what I read about him
a few days ago in the Guardian:
==+==
Now in his 80s, Mr Edelman wrote a letter early this month to Palestinian
leaders. Though the letter criticised the suicide bombers, its tone
infuriated the Israeli government and its press. He wrote in a spirit of
solidarity from a fellow resistance fighter, as a former leader of a Jewish
uprising not dissimilar in desperation to the Palestinian uprising in the
occupied territories. He addressed his letter to "commanders of the
Palestinian military, paramilitary and partisan operations - to all the
soldiers of the Palestinian fighting organisations".
This set up a howl of rage in the Zionist press, who reminded their readers
that Mr Edelman, despite his heroism in the 1940s, is a former supporter of
the anti-Zionist socialist Bund, and can therefore not be trusted. Nothing
infuriates Zionists more than the arguments of anti-Zionist Jews, who have
such a courageous and principled history. The essence of the intellectual
case for Zionism is that its opponents are anti-semitic. But when Jews,
especially heroic Jews such as Marek Edelman, speak out against Zionism, and
especially if they denounce Israeli imperialism and defend the victims of
it, how can they be accused of anti-semitism? What a boost it would be for
the Palestinians and their cause - and for peace in the Middle East - if
Marek Edelman could attend the Barghouti trial.
==+==
I don't know enough about the generalities of life in the Polish ghetto to
say if you are right and he is wrong. However, I do know that what Israel
does day-in day-out in the occupied territories is very wrong. Indeed, in
recent days there has been quite a debate about this in the UK press. The
starting point was comments make by Britain's chief rabbi in the Guardian:
==+==
"I regard the current situation as nothing less than tragic," he told the
Guardian in an exclusive interview. "It is forcing Israel into postures that
are incompatible in the long run with our deepest ideals."
He went on to speak of being "profoundly shocked" at reports of smiling
Israeli servicemen posing for a photograph with the corpse of a slain
Palestinian. "There is no question that this kind of prolonged conflict,
together with the absence of hope, generates hatreds and insensitivities
that in the long run are corrupting to a culture."
He also admitted that in 1967 he was "convinced that Israel had to give back
all the [newly gained] land for the sake of peace" - and he does not
renounce that view now.
==+==
But John, no doubt you would say that both Rabbi Sacks and Mr Edelman are wrong?
Scott A
>
> -John
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