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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Erik Olson writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Pedro Silva writes:
> > In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Erik Olson writes:
> > > Read of the end of Carthage:
> > > http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/polybius-punic3.html
> > > Don't skip the last paragraph where Scipio compares Carthage to Troy.
> >
> > One could compare it to a much more present situation :-)
> > (funny how History repeats itself over and over again)
> >
> > > Innumerable wars have ended with complete annihilation of the enemy.
> >
> > Are you sure that so many wars ended that way? From my own experience, I
> > think it's a lot more common that the "losers" of one civilization will
> > eventually "melt" with the civilization which beat them.
>
> That might be more common. Could ask the Statistics of Deadly Quarrels
> research folks about the majority.
Fair enough :-)
> So maybe not so many whole civilizations, but certainly city-states and
> isolated population centers. Philip II at Thebes. Alexander at Persepolis.
> It's hard to read a 4th or 3rd century BC history that doesn't feature the
> selling into slavery of an entire minor city (after slaughtering and
> looting.) Populations uprooted to fill up some tyrant's new capital.
That is true, although it does not tell us what happened to the slaves *in
time*: did their descendents eventually gain citizenship? Were they
assimilated? The city state, having been overrun, was it rebuilt? Did the
civilization to which it belonged outlive the city?
> On a cheerier note, for the "Persistence of Antiquity" file, today's Wall
> Street Journal mentions the Torre de Hercules lighthouse built by Romans in
> the 2nd century north of La Coruña.
Oldest continuously operated lighthouse in Europe, AFAIK. Once I climbed to
the top and saw the whole of La Coruña's beautiful bay from above... it's a
pity now the whole perspective is *black* :-(
(I'm thinking of going to Galicia this weekend to help clean the beaches, if
weather permits)
> Below that is an article on the
> Pentathlon: "Advocates argue it is the [last] sport which hews to the
> Olympic notion of testing a range of physical, mental, and emotional
> capabilities. Replacing it with something more popular–the IOC commitee
> recommended golf–would undermine that ideal.... The Greeks ran the games for
> a thousand years, but when the Romans tried to make a circus of it, the
> Games died."
I agree completely. Besides, I don't find any interest in watching golf... ;-)
(out of curiosity, the Tower and the games are separate articles, aren't they?)
Pedro
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Carthage
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| (...) Who knows? But there are not too many identifiable folk who have not assimilated. That nobody really understands precisely what a helot was, is one demonstration. I know of a story of one annihilated city whose survivors petitioned their (...) (22 years ago, 27-Nov-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Carthage
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| (...) That might be more common. Could ask the Statistics of Deadly Quarrels research folks about the majority. So maybe not so many whole civilizations, but certainly city-states and isolated population centers. Philip II at Thebes. Alexander at (...) (22 years ago, 26-Nov-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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