Subject:
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Re: LEGO Inspired Fonts For Macintosh And Windows
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.geek
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Date:
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Fri, 18 May 2001 15:20:32 GMT
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Viewed:
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370 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.geek, Matthew Gerber writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.geek, Larry Pieniazek writes:
> Here again though, I have chosen to participate, and should live with what
> is offered-their vision of what their site should be! I don't complain when
> IT IS NOT MY PLACE TO DO SO.
You, in this case, asked for input. I gave it. Sorry that the input you
asked for wasn't what you wanted to hear.
But more importantly, there is value in complaining about things to the
owners, even if that complaint is unsolicited. I complain about
unsatisfactory service I receive whether or not there is a comment card. I
complain to eBay even though they actively do not want my comments.
Surely you don't think that because TLC did not ask for our input (about
their site, their products, etc.) that we should not give it anyway? Are you
actually saying that our only choices are to either partake silently or turn
away with no comment whatsoever? Surely that's not what you meant.
I'm from the school that the person putting up the money (to do something
like host a site) can take or leave the comments and has the final say. But
I'm NOT from the school that feels that person is the only person who has
any valuable input. Users DO know things about their environment and about
how they want to interact with it.
This user, this customer, this whatever.... this person feels fixed size
sites are wrong. And has explained why. Take or leave that input as you would.
But don't ask for input and then when you get input that shows you are
incorrect in your viewpoint, claim that you didn't ask.
> > > And so far, I'm happy with the results *as a designer*. Now, as
> > > users, what do others think? Well, that's why I wrote this little rant. What
> > > do YOU think?
> >
> > You are incorrect, sir. See above.
>
> I'm incorrect in being happy with the results myself? Confirm if you would
> please.
Yes, you are incorrect in being happy with your results unless you do not
care at all what your users think, in which case you are correct in being happy.
> > However you can get away with it better at a fan site than you can in real
> > life. Designers that work on my commercial projects do not get a free hand
> > to do as they see fit artistically, they are strongly reminded who the
> > customer is and why the customer is usually right and why the customer needs
> > to be catered to instead of dictated to.
The customer in this context is the end user, not me. I am merely the system
integrator, marrying wilful designers, obstinate clients and the needs of
the users of the system to come up with a successful project. Catering to
the needs of the end user is not fawning.
> Yes, but the whole reason a customer (when did we get into customers instead
> of users anyway?) seeks a professional is to get what they themselves cannot
> acheive. While you may earn business by fawning, you will build lasting
> relationships by partnering. If a design client comes to me with their whole
> project done in their head, I'm just meat with know-how. If they come
> seeking advice and want to work WITH me, I'm a professional. But this seems
> off topic here, so I'll stop now.
It's not what I was saying, exactly. I'm pretty sure I have never fawned. If
anything I get counseled for telling my clients the truth a bit too bluntly.
However you are correct, all the people engaged in a project should be
working together to make sure that the best project possible is what is
delivered. But best means understanding the needs of all the stakeholders,
not *just* the artistic desires.
I'm pretty satisfied, based on the level of demand for my services, that my
approach is correct. All viewpoints should be considered but the end user,
who has to live with the system, needs to get a large voice in the process.
An overriding one unless there are much stronger constraints. That's for
commercial systems and sites, of course, not fan sites. But the principles,
though greatly weakened, still apply.
++Lar
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: LEGO Inspired Fonts For Macintosh And Windows
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| (...) See below (...) See below (...) See below (...) See below (...) See below (...) Larry, you are truly the master of attributing your words and ideas to the wants/needs/desires/...ughts/etc. of others. If you have taken anything I have written (...) (24 years ago, 18-May-01, to lugnet.off-topic.geek)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: LEGO Inspired Fonts For Macintosh And Windows
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| (...) Ah, but no one is forcing you to view the material! You make a concious decision to partake of what is offered. (...) Here again though, I have chosen to participate, and should live with what is offered-their vision of what their site should (...) (24 years ago, 18-May-01, to lugnet.off-topic.geek)
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