Subject:
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Re: Microsoft and IBM in secret plot?
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Tue, 14 Sep 2004 22:23:47 GMT
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Viewed:
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874 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Don Heyse wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek wrote:
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I’m surprised to see no mention yet here of “rathergate” as it is being
called in the blogosphere. Were the memos about Bush’s service that
CBS 60 minutes ran a story on forged or real?
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They’re clearly forgeries, but the fun part now is developing the
best conspiracy theory.
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Somebody has it in for Dan Rather and CBS. The documents are clearly
forgeries meant to make DR and CBS look silly. They have been had, and how!
Now, here is the problem: if CBS admits the docs are fake, they will be
ethically bound to reveal the source of the docs. They clearly would rather
twist in the wind than do that. Why? Probably because the means by which
the docs were obtained was in some way unethical as well.
So, Dan Rather and CBS are screwed, coming and going. Somebody somewhere
should be taking a bow...
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On what basis do you conclude that these documents are forgeries? I remind
you that the claims re: non-availability of font-type; non-availability of
proportional spacing; and non-availability of super-script have all been
thoroughly refuted. What other evidence to you care to produce?
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The evidence is voluminous, but here is the most recent I’ve seen:
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By PETE SLOVER / The Dallas Morning News
HOUSTON – The former secretary for the Texas Air National Guard colonel who
supposedly authored memos critical of President Bush’s Guard service said
Tuesday that the documents are fake, but that they reflect real documents that
once existed.
Marian Carr Knox, who worked from 1956 to 1979 at Ellington Air Force Base in
Houston, said she prided herself on meticulous typing, and the memos first
disclosed by CBS News last week were not her work.
“These are not real,” she told The Dallas Morning News after examining copies
of the disputed memos for the first time. “They’re not what I typed, and I would
have typed them for him.”
Mrs. Knox, 86, who spoke with precise recollection about dates, people and
events, said she is not a supporter of Mr. Bush, who she deemed “unfit for
office” and “selected, not elected.”
“I remember very vividly when Bush was there and all the yak-yak that was going
on about it,” she said.
But, she said, telltale signs of forgery abounded in the four memos, which
contained the supposed writings of her ex-boss, Lt. Col. Jerry Killian, who died
in 1984.
She said the typeface on the documents did not match either of the two
typewriters that she used during her time at the Guard. She identified those
machines as a mechanical Olympia, which was replaced by an IBM Selectric in the
early 1970s.
She spoke fondly of the Olympia machine, which she said had a key with the “th”
superscript character that was the focus of much debate in the CBS memos.
Experts have said that the Selectric, and mechanical typewriters such as the
Olympia, could not produce proportional spacing, found in the disputed
documents.
CBS officials have defended their report. They have declined to say who provided
60 Minutes with the documents, other than that it was an “unimpeachable source”
– or exactly where they came from, other than Lt. Col. Killian’s “personal
file.”
The memos, if real, would show that as a pilot, Mr. Bush defied a direct order
to obtain a flight physical, enjoyed the benefit of pressure from high officials
to “sugar coat” his record, and was grounded for failing to meet military
performance standards.
Mrs. Knox said she did all of Lt. Col. Killian’s typing, including memos for a
personal “cover his back” file he kept in a locked drawer of his desk.
She said she did not recall typing the memos reported by CBS News, though she
said they accurately reflect the viewpoints of Lt. Col. Killian and documents
that would have been in the personal file. Also, she could not say whether the
CBS documents corresponded memo for memo with that file.
“The information in here was correct, but it was picked up from the real ones,”
she said.
She said that the culture of the time was that men didn’t type office-related
documents, and she expressed doubt that Lt. Col. Killian would have typed the
memos. She said she would typically type his memos from his handwritten notes,
which she would then destroy.
Mrs. Knox, who left the Guard before Lt. Col. Killian died, said she was not
sure of the disposition of his personal files when he died while still serving
at Ellington. But, she said, it would have been logical that a master sergeant
who worked in the squadron headquarters would have destroyed any such
nonofficial documents after Lt. Col. Killian’s death.
That man, reached Tuesday, declined to comment. “I don’t know anything about the
matter,” he said.
She also said the memos may have been constructed from memory by someone who had
seen Lt. Col. Killian’s private file but were not transcriptions because the
language and terminology did not match what he would have used.
For instance, she said, the use of the words “billets” and a reference to the
“administrative officer” of Mr. Bush’s squadron reflect Army terminology rather
than the Air National Guard. Some news reports attribute the CBS reports to a
former Army National Guard officer who has a longstanding dispute with the Guard
and has previously maintained that the president’s record was sanitized.
Mrs. Knox also cited stylistic differences in the form of the notes, such as the
signature on the right side of the document, rather than the left, where she
would have put it.
===
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Additionally, since you clearly watched the entire program with an objective,
critical eye, you must recognize that the entirety of the very damning case
against AWOL Bush does not rest on the documents, correct?
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Sorry, I don’t watch TV and never saw the program. Interestingly though, look
for breaking news about Kerry dodging his remaining military time commitment...
Stick a fork in Kerry-- he is done.
JOHN
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Message is in Reply To:
 | | Re: Microsoft and IBM in secret plot?
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| (...) On what basis do you conclude that these documents are forgeries? I remind you that the claims re: non-availability of font-type; non-availability of proportional spacing; and non-availability of super-script have all been thoroughly refuted. (...) (20 years ago, 14-Sep-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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