 | | Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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I'm giving a presentation about Mindstorms on Wednesday. I have a slide near the end that talks about all the stuff I know people want to see added. Here's what I have so far: RCX === RC communication (but keep the IR port, too) more I/O ports (...) (21 years ago, 3-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, lugnet.technic, lugnet.trains, lugnet.dacta, lugnet.edu, lugnet.dear-lego, lugnet.general, FTX)
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| | Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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"Jordan Bradford" <bradfj23REMOVE_THIS...uwosh.edu> wrote in message news:HnsHtA.12z9@lugnet.com... (...) near the (...) what (...) intensity) (...) high (...) TECHNIC (...) see (...) besides (...) good (...) I'd prefer a DC connection over AC. (...) (21 years ago, 3-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) Jordan, I guess I'll represent the populace of the Official Lego MindStorms Forums here. We've had a discussion going on this very topic (mechanical and mindstorms-specific) for about four years now on and off. As with most forums we often go (...) (21 years ago, 3-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) TECHNIC (...) see (...) besides (...) good (...) I'd like to see color camera (and sound?) support without having my bot lug around a 15' cable. How about some wireless camera or a camera that will plug in to said RCX and send data through (...) (21 years ago, 3-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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What I'd like to see is MUCH more elaborate expansion capability fot a completely new RCX paradigm. Using something like, say, pcmcia-ish cards to add new capabilities to the unit as desired. One card might add a dozen sensor inputs, while another (...) (21 years ago, 3-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) Did you mean 'RF' communication? Thanks Bruce ------- WWW.SYSTRONIX.COM ---...--- Real embedded Java and much more www.jrealtime.com and www.tstik.com +1-801-534-1017 Salt Lake City, USA (21 years ago, 3-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) I think all these would be nice. However I think the 2 I'd like to see first are more I/O and more memory. (...) I think this is mostly a software issue, and AFOL solutions (well at least (URL) one>) are already available. Note that more (...) (21 years ago, 3-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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(...) I pretty much agree with what's there. Top priority has to be a power input jack, for running static exhibits. A proper angular input sensor, and an angular output (i.e. servo). Gyro/compass would be a big help. If it's going to stay on (...) (21 years ago, 3-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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(...) Well, this whole thread has been visited before as has been pointed out, but it never hurts to air the subject again. And of course, I couldn't resist joining in ;) As far as the RCX goes and in concert with most other respondees, more (...) (21 years ago, 3-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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(...) John, (and group) IM(very)HO, I've always felt a more distributed modular "brick" would be the way to go, AND still follow the original design of the concept of the core brick. these guys are my inspiration: (URL) a future RCX, some sort of (...) (21 years ago, 4-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) Why not use Bluetooth for the wireless. I dont know a huge deal about it but from what I have read, it would work great. (21 years ago, 4-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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Jordan: My approach to a MindStorms 3.0 would be more distributed. The system I came up with is called RoboBricks and can be seen here: (URL) Each sensor/actuator has a dedicated microcontroller that deals with any real time sensor issues. -Wayne (...) (21 years ago, 4-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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What they need to do is make it like a PDA with a compact flash slot. Then you could expand as needed. You could connect two controllers to communicate via 802.11 or bluetooth, etc. Or a CPU with CAN? It would be fairly cheap. Connect everything (...) (21 years ago, 4-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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hi i've posted it some time ago but there was no big response maybe because there was no possibility like this wish list if TLC is going to use liftarms as the basis of their models 2x2 connector brick is, i would say, stupid (however it's great for (...) (21 years ago, 4-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) I agree that a modular approach would be both more Lego-like and more userful. Say a processor unit, a display unit, an input unit, a hub, and a memory unit accepting CompactFlash cards. Let everything run off standard Lego 9V, so you could (...) (21 years ago, 4-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) It does sometimes, but shielding in the unit does disrupt the signal. I would like the battery compartment to be separated from the CPU box, so we can distribute the weight and have two smaller boxes. That way, my designs don't need to allow (...) (21 years ago, 4-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) Yes I did. Thanks! I fixed it in my .ppt file. (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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maybe sensors could have its own battery (watch like) and blue tooth connection with its rcx all problems with separation would be solved via configuration cause i think all sensors could be addressed separately so even somo robots could work (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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what a terrible mistakes in spelling words :((( sorry :) pixel "pixel" <pixsrv@poczta.onet.pl> wrote in message news:HnvF8v.1po3@lugnet.com... (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) Reading this thread, I am struck by one thought: who would actually pay for a souped-up RCX with intelligent sensors and BlueTooth in every sensor? I could see BlueTooth in every RCX, but it would be overkill for talking with sensors. A (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | More Speed? Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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(...) I can see the need for more I/O from the RCX, but I really don't understand why everyone thinks it needs more memory and CPU speed. I'm interested to hear about any projects that people have attempted which required more of either. Steve (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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(...) I agree - it's basically a good idea - but it's probably too expensive. (...) Using bluetooth for communications between RCX's - or between RCX and PC - is a bit of a non-starter, the range of bluetooth is intentionally rather short. An 802.11 (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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"Chris Phillips" <drvegetable@attbi.com> wrote in message news:Hnvw3v.23z3@lugnet.com... (...) i know this thread shouldn't be any kind of discussion but just to explain my idea i've to say i thought about just possibility to join blue tooth (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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While this might not be a "need" per se, I'd like to see another option for communication between RCX's than just infrared. Specifically, a port to be used specifically for this purpose, and a communication API. As far as I/O, some kind of bus (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: More Speed? Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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(...) I like using NQC because of the simplicity of downloading byte code based programs onto the Lego firmware environment. Using NQC, the CPU would need to be at least 10x to 100x faster to run the kind of programs I would like to run at an (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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| | RE: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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(...) As I've pointed out many times in the past, the RCX is faster and has more memory than the comuter in the LEM that allowed astronauts to got to the moon and back. (URL) The difference is that we are missing I/O expansion - and on top of that (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: More Speed? Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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(...) This could be addressed on the existing hardware with a better programming environment. What I have in mind is a new NQC compiler that generates a firmware file instead of a bytecode file. So you would code in NQC (or something like it) and (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: More Speed? Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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(...) Are you sure? How many square inches are there in a 1600 square foot house? I don't think the resulting map array will fit in 32k memory. JB (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) There are 230,400 square inches in a 1,600 sq-ft house. But you are assuming that you cannot somehow compress the information that you are trying to store. How many chair legs are in your house? Store the location and size of every obstruction (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) Lots of interesting ideas in this thread! But I feel the need to point out that the 3.0 has to still be 'kid friendly'. The RCX is designed for ages 12 and up, the 3.0 should be in the same age range, otherwise Lego loses a huge part of their (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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(...) I was using the chair leg as an example. I want to wander around ticking off square inches as I encounter them as navigable or not. I don't want to spend my life trying to develop fancy ways of representing inch square "occupiedness" by any (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) Hmm... I think all Chris was trying to say is that there are software techniques that could make your task doable with the current RCX. I know as a programmer, I always try to seek software solutions that maximize the hardware available. Other (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) off (...) spend my (...) "occupiedness" by (...) byte (...) then I (...) a (...) my (...) job (...) concentrate (...) is to (...) right (...) one (...) memory (...) John and Chris: If there are 8 bits in a byte, 1024 bytes in a kilobyte, and (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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I think you are right on... Rand "Chris Phillips" <drvegetable@attbi.com> wrote in message news:Hnvw3v.23z3@lugnet.com... (...) this (...) ton (...) it (...) for a (...) could (...) sensors. (...) dead) (...) $500 if (...) sensor (...) RCX? (...) to (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) Agreed. This is critical for LEGO (while I would, of course, prefer that a major corperation design products specificly aimed at *ME*, that might be, well... a tad unrealistic). (...) Perhaps. Personally, I'd like to see a true "sleep" mode (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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(...) I believe that is exactly what legOS does. It compiles your program and stores it in the firmware area. legOS has no firmware, and it ignores the ROM code, too. It accesses all the hardware directly. That's my understanding, at least. (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) Your understanding is correct. So why doesn't everybody use BrickOS? There are at least two reasons that I am aware of: 1. Many people, especially "non-programmers" find a full-blown C++ implementation to be intimidating and non-user-friendly. (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: More Speed? Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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(...) Still, no one's been able to convince me that the RCX needs more speed or memory. I can see the desire to map a room, but given the building materials, I think very few, if any, builders would be able to even build a LEGO robot that can (...) (21 years ago, 5-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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Here is the perfect idea: Basicly, the new RCX comes with several components: 1.sensors, motors and so on as now (perhaps with some new ones) 2.a large "base unit" that would have a good CPU, communication with the host PC for programming, LCD (...) (21 years ago, 6-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: More Speed? Re: Mindstorms 3.0 Wish List
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(...) Two words... "sparse array" The cpu in the RCX is plenty fast enough to handle the proccessing overhead incurred in accessing such an array. To work out how much space in such an array your house would require, add the perimeters measured in (...) (21 years ago, 6-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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External power Flash memory (no more losing the firmware and programming when power is removed or batteries die) An extensible 2-wire sensor bus allowing up to about 16 sensors attached to just one port on the RCX (freeing up 2 port locations) A (...) (21 years ago, 6-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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(...) Lejos is notoriously short on memory, with a half decent communication stack the RCX is full. In general I'd say with more memory and speed you can program more "high-level", and build more intelligent robots. As for a new RCX version I'd say (...) (21 years ago, 6-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) The one thing I would say about this is that anyone who has ever tried to write replacement firmware, or who has programmed in BrickOS/LegOS has encountered situations where the RCX has become completely locked up due to a programming error. (...) (21 years ago, 7-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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(...) ...and make sure that you don't accidentally hit the ON button while a battery is removed, as it would mean instantaneous memory erase! Philo (21 years ago, 7-Nov-03, to lugnet.robotics)
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