Subject:
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Re: Finally some church/state mingling that I can really get behind!
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 13 Aug 2003 14:31:23 GMT
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Viewed:
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188 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Carl Nelson wrote:
> > http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0610-08.htm
> Charity is absolutely a Christian (and most other religions', at that) value.
> The problem is, the government is not a charitable organization. God wants us
> to give money not because He needs it (televangelism aside <g>) but for what
> the act of giving does for us.
And what, exactly, does it do for us? If charity is performed to achieve a
space in heaven, then it's a simple economic transaction designed to favor
oneself with a payoff disproportionate to the act of charity.
> The vast majority of taxes (state, anyway) pay for education, roads,
> tourism advertising, business development, government salaries, state
> troopers, et al.--hardly charitable giving.
On the contrary--public roads, public education, many government services, and
a host of other programs contribute to the public good, which is a worthy end in
itself, but which also contributes to additional public good in the form of
increased accessibility (roads), increased opportunity (education), increased
general welfare (gov't programs), etc.
You might cite government corruption or wasteful use of taxpayer money (such
as a $4Billion/month oil war, for example), but I can as readily cite
misappropriation of charitible donations (such as the huge salary paid to the
former CEO of the Red Cross, to name just one example).
I grant you that freemarketeers will denounce all of these public programs as
The Great Satan, and that's an argument worth exploring, but it's tangential to
what you and I are discussing.
> Now, look at your pay stub and circle the amount that you paid for taxes.
> Multiply it by your number of paychecks in a year. Write a check for
> estimated quarterly taxes. Fill out your tax return. Do you get the same
> feeling as when you give or do good works?
You appear to be suggesting that my good works should be motivated by:
A) A desire to placate a deity (which is a selfish motive)
B) A desire to "feel good" (which is a selfish motive)
or
C) Because *I* judge the recipient to be worthy (which is a selfish motive)
To be clear--I'm not suggesting that a selfish motive is a bad motive, but it's
by definition not altruistic.
Additionally, you're stacking the deck in your favor by the way you're asking
the question. You're identifying only the negative aspect of taxation (ie, the
shortage of one's own funds) while identifying only the positive aspects of
voluntary charitable giving (ie, the "good" feeling one gets). That's a
strawman argument.
Let's look at it from the opposite perspective. At the end of the year, add up
the money you've given to charity, and tell me what the return has been to you.
Good feelings? Maybe, but so what? And then look at the public roads, the
regulated food and medicine, the subsidized utilities, your computer, the
Internet, and the education you enjoy (to name just a tiny few) and ask yourself
what it would have cost you to purchase all those things for yourself on your
own. Additionally, as a good citizen, you gain the satisfaction of knowing that
your small tax burden has been used to help those less fortunate than you.
You have objected that failure to pay taxes will result in imprisonment. That's
true, but only if you continue to remain under the jurisdiction of the
tax-levying system. You're absolutely free to leave the country and move to an
area that doesn't collect taxes, and then you'll have that much more money to
donate to your favorite charitable institution. Of course, you won't have
access to the luxuries currently afforded you, but you're still welcome to
remove yourself from the tax cycle. But if you want to continue to enjoy the
tax-subsidized niceties of modern American life, then you should expect to have
to meet your share of the cost (ie, pay your taxes); otherwise, you're just a
squatter.
Dave!
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