Subject:
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Re: Sex Scandal: U.S. President had sex with Intern!
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 21 May 2003 06:24:35 GMT
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Viewed:
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341 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler writes:
> Annoyingly, I was unable to post to LUGNET for a few weeks and wasn't able
> to contribute in my usual, brilliant fashion. I apologize for the late
> response to Scott's posting, but this was just about my first opportunity to
> do so.
Wow Dave, this was so old I almost forgot I wrote about this. Alright as it
appears that there were some huge misunderstandings in my post let me try to
clarify things.
First and foremost, I do have core beliefs as to what is right and wrong,
they are based largely on upbringing, religious belief, personal experience,
and the experience of others. I make no apology for my beliefs, nor do I try
to force others by coercion or guilt to follow my beliefs. I am very willing
when asked, and in the case of my closest friends even when not asked, to
offer my opinions based on my core morality.
Yes, a part of that morality is that homosexuality, extra marital sex, and
unmarried co-habitation are wrong. Please help me see how views are
intolerant, and if they are why intolerance should not be tolerated (did
that make sense?). I am not heavy handed in my beliefs, I never pass
judgment on the character of a person, nor would I alienate anyone in these
lifestyles. I am very willing, however, to express my opinions unsolicited
to my closest friends, isn’t that what friends are for? So I guess this
whole discussion comes down to how you define tolerance. If you believe like
I do that tolerance is treating everyone equally despite differences in
race, ideology, lifestyle, etc, then yes I have no problem with tolerance.
However if you believe that in order for someone to be “tolerant” they must
whole heartedly accept the practices of another group as normal, good and/or
healthy, then I guess you will have to paint me intolerant.
<snip>
> And here's another problem! Who are you to deign to be tolerant of him?
> That presupposes that you are in a position to rule yea or nay on his
> lifestyle, and really that's not the case. You may elect not to associate
> with him, and you may choose privately not to approve of his lifestyle
> choice, and you may certainly offer your opinion if he solicits it, but it's
> grossly presumptuous to volunteer your judgment as though you speak from
> some higher moral plateau.
Suffice it to say that I in no way feel morally superior, and he in no way
feels judged of me, I spoke to him as a friend offering advice, not as a
pastor warning of impending doom.
> You describe your friend's revelation of
> his homosexuality by saying that he "confessed to all of us," as if he'd
> committed a sin before the congregation. • <snip>
> Of course, it may be that your friend has previously concealed his
> homosexuality and is "confessing" his guilt about this concealment.
> However, I don't get that impression from your post. If that's what you're
> trying to convey, you should restate your point more clearly.
I am sorry if I was unclear, but that is exactly what I meant. My “inner
circle” of friends have been together over ten years, and in all that time
he hid his sexuality. The confession/transgression was more that he had lied
to us, his closest friends for all those years, and didn't trust that we
would be understanding.
> Especially interesting is the fact that the friend whom you assert to be part of your
> "inner-circle" expected a sharply intolerant response from you. It may be
> that others perceive you (and your "tolerance") in a manner quite different
> from what you might prefer to convey.
This last statement has me thinking, perhaps I too am a victim of some level
of intolerance and bigotry. I am being half serious, because my friends
assumption of my response was based solely on my religious convictions.
Since publicly “coming out of the closet” about my being a Mormon here on
OTD, I have been the victim of several assumptions and the occasional pot
shot. I am not offended; my skin is pretty thick, but you have to admit,
bigotry against someone based on religion is just as bad as bigotry based on
bed room practices.
Finally good to have you back Dave, I’ve missed you insight lately.
Scott C.
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