 | | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) Over the past couple of months I have occasionally been sending letters to the local paper in my neck of the woods in response to another gentleman who has been doing the same. (Most of which, the paper has been printing on both sides of the (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) Shearly you jest, but you may wool be correct; my baaaad:-) (...) I swear I was only helping the sheep over the fence.... JOHN (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) Good suggestions all. I'd like to disclaim, though, that my original (URL) formulation> of the question made a few stipulations, among them the following: Values predating Judeo-Christianity must not be included (ie, “do unto others...”) (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) I submit that history shows the strong ties between religion and government by the presence of many state-enforced religions (including Islam in much of the Middle East, the Anglican Church in England, and Atheism in the ex-U.S.S.R.). I submit (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) Somehow I can't imagine the sheep objecting, but I must admit that my expertise on such "relationships" is limited solely to two rather off-color jokes, so others here might know better than I... ;P (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Not the right way to exit?
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(...) Because the longer we stay there, the more it looks like they're a puppet government controlled by the US. And if they can't stand on their own without having us there to quell rebellion, they effectively are, by virtue of the fact that we'd (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) (URL) fun) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.off-topic.fun)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, David Eaton wrote: <snip> (...) And the scary bit is that, from what I've read, all Dave's seem to be on the same page regarding this issue, and these Dave's come from widely divergent backgrounds. Wow! Dave K -go Daves (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) So your point is that the state has a vested interest in NOT recognizing marriages? Why? I thought your point (in a past debate) was that somehow gay marriage negatively affected the American family, which was the foundation of society (though (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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"Larry Pieniazek" <larry.(mylastname)@...areDOTcom> wrote in message news:I14L96.1r36@lugnet.com... (...) to/seem (...) debunking (...) Hmm, is that debunking that democracies tend to/seem to go to war less, or debunking that certain nations are (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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"Dave Schuler" <orrex@excite.com> wrote in message news:I15rpI.1v7n@lugnet.com... (...) pee in (...) so, (...) involving the (...) in the (...) I'm with you on this one. I visited a dorm at MIT that had a co-ed bathroom, that had multiple stalls (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) I recognize that the law requires boys to pee in one place and girls to pee in another, but I can't really think of a solid reason that this should be so, other than because people can be quaintly immature about functions involving the (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) How many persons? (...) So are public restrooms. Are you against separating those? (...) For what possible reason? That is downright strange. (...) Well, that "church" has some issues. (...) lol "evolution of society"? Are you so sure our (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) So you would have no objection if the Federal government enacted laws barring Christians from marrying? I want you to go on record on this, with the following qualifiers: You can't claim "our country is based on Judeo-Christian tradition" (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) Hey, I'm cool with that. Whoever brings the issue to the table has done the right thing, IMO. I figured that John was right in citing Left-leaning judges as the source of the current controversy, but if the controversy began its momentum with (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) The state should recognize marraige as a contract between persons, no matter their sexual affiliation. If the Church wants to put quantifiers on that contract, i.e. one person must be female, and the other must be male, all the power to the (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) This discussion is about the definition of marriage, Dave. How would you define it? (...) The issue is whether the state has a vested interest in recognizing marriages or not. JOHN (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) Ever tried to use the women's restroom? Or do you advocate unisex bathrooms? JOHN (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) BUT, does the state have a vested interest in promoting certain contracts above others? Marriage and families are pretty efficient at raising the next generation of citizens (at least as compared to the state). What is wrong with giving these (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Nike sued over a stick-man drawing?
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Honestly, I think Nike ripped off xiaoxiao but will win the case ;-) (...) What's that? I live outside the US. (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) For instance, show me in the Constitution the right to marry. You will have to stretch and twist, until finally you can come up with a ruling such as Roe vs Wade that allows a women to kill her baby in her third trimester of pregnancy under (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Not the right way to exit?
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(...) I agree, but it wouldn't be right to leave them before they were ready and able to defend their land and freedom on their own. And what is the rush, anyway? We are a powerful ally, and a valuable resource. The smart would utilize us, not (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) The operative word I'd say would be "two". (...) Not really. Marriage is a religious institution-- that governments decide to recognize marriages as civil unions is where the rub lies. All I am arguing is for the preservation of the definition (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) Don't forget anullment which is the Catholics' way of getting around that little religious entanglement. (...) Now, see, there you're just restricting the rights of the citizenry to break their solemn vows. That'll never fly (heck, in (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Not the right way to exit?
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(...) Every wrong? No more than the next guy, which is to say that we shouldn't just ignore them if we have the power to coerce them to go away, and we shouldn't be unwilling to step up and correct them by force if it's unconscionable not to do so. (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Nike sued over a stick-man drawing?
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(...) Okay, I've watched it now. Thanks for the link, BTW. It's actually quite an amusing little ad. Now, Even though the Nike version moves in a less jerky manner, pulls all kinds of weird body stunts that the xiaoxiao version doesn't, interacts (...) (20 years ago, 19-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) How is allowing or not allowing same-sex marriages going to affect this? I mean, it's a valid concern and all, but forbidding two guys to get married with each other won't make them want to get married to women and have kids, and allowing two (...) (20 years ago, 19-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Not the right way to exit?
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(...) At least, that's how you _hope_ it'll look when you choose not to get involved. It seems that half of the Middle East hates us because we did get involved in one situation, and half of the Middle east hates us because we didn't in another, so (...) (20 years ago, 19-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) But there IS a humane way. Help societies to move away from subsistence agriculture (and the modern sweatshop equivalent) by introducing the rule of law, property rights, and fostering the growth of free enterprise. This reduces the incentive (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) I'm not seeing where that description of linkage rules out a similar linkage with another willing partner, although I'd grant that it does rule out the partmer being the same gender. I'm also not seeing the relevance to constitutional rights (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) Yep, you've just lost any sense of moral ground--"let no man separate". As long as "man" is separating, you've got nothing. Get rid of divorce (man separating the covenant that 'God joined'), get rid of adultery and coveting, and then we may (...) (20 years ago, 19-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Not the right way to exit?
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(...) No, it's saying I have an opinion about it and that's what it is, and despite it being *my* opinion, I'm not claiming infallability about it merely because I stated it. Sorry if that phrasing caused confusion. Hope that helps. (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler wrote: (snipped a bunch of rehash of why John's confused about what right of free association means) (...) You give the Left too much credit here. Insofar as there is any validity in the Right/Left labels (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Not the right way to exit?
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(...) I liked Dave K's response here, so this is just embellishment. As long as we bill ourselves as the world's policeman it is. As soon as cops can't enforce, they lose their power. That's where we are now. But that's the wrong reason. We should (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Santorum Fails In His Effort To Pervert The Constitution
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(...) Are you feeling ok, John? This is precisely what I've been arguing all along. Let the parties to the contract (or the private contracting/sanctioning organization) define who can participate. Keep the state out of interfering with the right of (...) (20 years ago, 20-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Not the right way to exit?
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(...) They may thank us for getting rid of Hussein, but they don't all want us to stay. The best analogy I've heard of this is shortly after the fall of Baghdad when an Iraqi citizen walked up to a US soldier and said something to the effect of, (...) (20 years ago, 19-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Not the right way to exit?
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(...) We'd lose any remaining credibility if we just annexed them into the US (not to mention the added drawback of being permanently stuck with them until either we or they are all dead, which is really a greater cost than the oil is worth), and we (...) (20 years ago, 19-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) This begs the question - with over 6 BILLION humans on this earth, do we REALLY need to make it easier for Breeders to spit out more humans than they should be? The earth would be far better off if we'd figure a *humane* way to scale the world (...) (20 years ago, 19-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Not the right way to exit?
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(...) Seriously, whom do you suppose we are fighting in Iraq? You are simply clueless. (...) Again, you have no idea what is going on in Iraq. The Iraqis want us to stay, not as a conqueror, but as a protector. The overwhelming majority of Iraqis (...) (20 years ago, 19-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: polygyny in "biblical times"
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(...) Why don't you leave the exogesis of the Bible to those who know what they are talking about (as you obviously don't). (...) The point is moot, to Christians at least. Jesus' teaching on the subject is clear, as He quotes from Genesis (...) (20 years ago, 19-Jul-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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