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Hi all, 1) I would like to mention a fact to this issue, which might help to understand the annoyance of nearly all German AFOLs (here on LUGNET and on 1000steine.de (see: (URL)). In Germany, the set was actually announced as limited. The official (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX) !
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| | Interesting point of view, Rene!
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Well, the combination of non-adherence to advertised values of the product and the legal endowment to return an item for refund if it does not match previously promised core properties could really lead to a case here (IMHO, IANAL). At the end of (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: Interesting point of view, Rene!
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(...) I wonder if the car companies go thru this when they released the PT Cruiser or the (hopefully upcoming) Dodge Charger "You promised me that this was the last model year of this vehicle!! I invested all my money into it and now, 20+ years (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update
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(...) Guten Tag, Rene! Hope fatherhood is treating you well:^D Thanks for bringing this into the discussion. It seems this information makes the case a little stronger against TLC. It's simply reckless and dishonest to advertise in this manner, IMO. (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX)
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| | Re: Interesting point of view, Rene!
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(...) David, what you're telling us with so many words is that you're happy with your existing collection so that you actually don't have to care what TLG does or does not. That's ok. Nothing wrong with being a happy AFOL dwelling in the past. 37 (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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(...) What constitutes actual advertising versus an employee stating something incorrectly? Was the phrasing of the post on 1000steine run by Lego's legal department, just as a paid advertisement would be? If they had instead said "This MIGHT be (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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In lugnet.lego, David Koudys wrote: <snip> (...) If they indeed said, "we will never produce this vehicle again" and they went ahead any way, you are okay with that??? Maybe this is a Liberal thing. It reminds me of a college professor who ran for a (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX)
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(...) It was correct, until TLC decided to make it incorrect by consciously changing their mind. (...) I think so. Then we would have recognized it as the typical BS advert hype which we all know to ignore. (...) Are you by chance a lawyer, Dave? If (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX)
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| | Re: 10152 Update
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(...) What's the use of integrity, if they go broke? Lego is a company, companies must generate profit or they will disappear, sales (mostly) generate profit ==> Lego should sell things. As many as they can. Not create artificial 'limited editions'. (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: Interesting point of view, Rene!
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(...) I got to 0 already because I keep getting this picture in my head: [comic book guy] Oh my gosh! The release will reduce the collectibility of my sets from 5 of 14000 to 5 of 2x000! I must go to the internet and complain! [/comic book guy] (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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(...) Uh, John. That *is* what Jake said. Well, he certainly didn't say claim anything *stronger* than that -- actually, what he said was more low key, if anything. (URL) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX)
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In lugnet.lego, Burkhard Schloemer wrote: [snippage] (...) are saying is so "George Double-You" that it is almost too good :-) So either we complain about every single thing TLC does or we don't CARE? How about all the fans that are happy with this (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: Interesting point of view, Rene!
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(...) know he's doing a great job at being a liason. I care so much that I'm spending more now on LEGO products than I did before. I care to the point where I do shows and displays to show off what can be done with LEGO bricks to get otehr people (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update
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(...) Are you implying that profitability and integrity are mutually exclusive? I hope not. JOHN (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX)
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| | Re: Interesting point of view, Rene!
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(...) That's not how I took it. But look at the way it was explained to the Germans via their liason (thanks to Rene's post): (URL) Doesn't get more clear than that IMO. JOHN (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX)
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(...) What is even more clear is that, at the time, TLC stated 'we have such-n-such quantity of Maersk Blue in stock and want to do something with it. Since, at htis time, we don't have a contract with Maersk for anything, we'll get rid of our stock (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX)
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(...) I'm glad I could be of service. ;) But I'm afraid you're mixing up so many things I really don't wish to sort it out for you. And better never, ever mention George Doubble-You to "Old Europeans" like me ... (...) Try something stronger than (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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(...) Perhaps I just read all statements from Lego as possibles, whereas others read them as 100% definites. Let's look at Jake's post: (URL) As many of you have seen from the leaked pictures online, we have released a > (...) Interpretation: Fact. (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX)
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| | Re: 10152 Update
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(...) No, I'm implying that listening to the groans from a minute part of a minor part of the customer base is not sound business. Making money is. (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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In lugnet.lego, René Hoffmeister wrote: Dear René, thanks for bringing these postings into the debate. Facts are: LEGO gave a promise and broke it (because they think they can generate profit out of this decision). Fact number 2 is: lots of people (...) (20 years ago, 20-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) To be honest, I could care less about what the company does. This is a hobby for me. What this means is that I refuse to let anything LEGO stress me out. In other words, I'll praise the company when they do something I like and ignore (...) (20 years ago, 21-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) Fact # 1: I have yet to see anyone produce the "PROMISE" that TLC gave. Fact # 2: I am one of those who IS very upset with the change to the colors. I have not spent one penny on new sets, nor will I any time soon. Old sets and parts will be (...) (20 years ago, 21-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: Interesting point of view, Rene!
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(...) Wrong end of the line. Imagine what car (or other companies) go through when they promise something in their advertising, and don't keep it. E.g. if the any car company advertises a car to run 100km with 3 litres (The task of calculating the (...) (20 years ago, 21-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) Rene presented them in his post, just one level above Bens posting: (URL) Quotes: “The edition of this set is likewise limited, there is a total of 14,000 copies” “This is your last chance to buy Maersk blue bricks” Yours, Christian (20 years ago, 21-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) Wrong. TLC stated that they had old Maersk Blue pellets and 'wouldn't it be nice to give the AFOL a really cool set and use up the pellets at the same time'. Why should that negate future contracts? It was a business decision made at the time (...) (20 years ago, 21-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) At the time, it was. Does that negate new contracts with Maersk? Dave K (20 years ago, 21-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) surely 0.8 cm is as metric as 1cm? Tim (20 years ago, 21-Dec-04, to lugnet.off-topic.geek)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) Sorry to correct you, Dave, but they did. Go read Renes posting. They called the set limited. And they announced it to be the very last chance to buy Mearsk blue. There are not 2 last chances in life. (...) If I call a product limited and give (...) (20 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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In lugnet.lego, Steven D. Weiser wrote: snipped some text to reduce it to something I'am confused about (...) Hi, in this discussion on lugnet.com almost everybody who wrote about collectors wrote in a very negative way. It seems as if in the (...) (20 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) Not what I intended to bring across. I am saying that any type of investment, wether it be the stock market, or the toy market, is risky business. You take your chances on making or losing money. I have purchased shares in companys that were (...) (20 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) Because they are the only one that would be negatively affected by this so called "collectibility" of this set, now that it is not so rare. (...) I know tons of those, generally from the anime toy fandom. Some of them buy two of each action (...) (20 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) Hey Ben, I think you know my feelings about crap bley and all of those silly excuses surrounding it. As you might have read elsewhere I didn't buy any new sets this year (except for bulk bricks at S@H), so you may have a clue of how I feel. In (...) (20 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: Interesting point of view, Rene!
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snippage (...) more snippage (...) John, I hate to be nitpicky here (oh, wait, half the posts on this thread are about being nitpicky), but I thought the color of set 10052 was yellow.. (URL) a different story... Scott (19 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego, FTX)
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(...) I seem to recall General Motors making a promise that they were going to release the new Camaro by "x" date....well, turns out that they didn't make it. The result? An advertising campaign featuring the "human caring factor" of a manager who (...) (19 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) [SNIP] (...) Dear Paulo! Thanks for your posting now! -And I remember you once answered in a very friendly way, when I explained, that I feel nearly expelled out of my hobby due to the bleys. It was possible your posting which kept me here at (...) (19 years ago, 22-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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(...) Nothing new. Already debunked by others. (...) Ha ha! Remember all those gambling toys a.k.a. bionical masks? Can they just honestly label their product instead of enouraging kids to play lottery? (...) Why do I keep hearing this ignorant (...) (19 years ago, 23-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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Your thought process, as enumerated below, is flabergasting in the scope of its naivete. You realize that Lego is fighting for its very survival, no? Maybe you're right. Better to have those kindly Danes keep making the brick until the company is (...) (19 years ago, 23-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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Hi Ka-On, <snipped> (...) Got me curious about this. It is really true what you are saying? Or are you talking about the average middle/high class? Isn't it true that overthere you have a lot of children labour? I saw a documentary in Discovery (...) (19 years ago, 23-Dec-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) <snip a bit of my stuff> (...) Dear Ben, I'm very glad that you noticed it and I'm really touched to see that you even recall it! I really think that you are (besides a {greatest} MOCcer, mind you!) one of the few persons that keep me hanging (...) (19 years ago, 23-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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| | Re: 10152 Update: What has TLC to do to bring YOU up against them?
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(...) Since LEGO is a private company, they can do anything they want. If LEGO decided to now make automotive parts or kitchen utensils or print newspapers there is nothing we can say as fans of the brick to make them change their mind. The LEGO (...) (19 years ago, 23-Dec-04, to lugnet.lego)
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