Subject:
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Re: WMD, again...
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 21 Apr 2003 20:04:28 GMT
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Viewed:
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234 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal writes:
> > In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Richard Marchetti writes:
> > > Illicit Arms Kept Till Eve of War, an Iraqi Scientist Is Said to Assert
> >
> > > Gee, this one scientist seems to confirm everything multiple intelligence
> > > agencies with several months lead time could not. And with no independent
> > > investigators to keep the Americans and the Brits honest either.
> > >
> > > Of course it's not a plant!
> >
> > Gee, this one scientist seems to confirm everything Bush asserted. Of course
> > it *is* a plant!
>
> John--if I told you that the Risen Christ appeared to me, and that He
> proclaimed to me that Christians have been doing everything wrong for ~2000
> years, would you believe me, or would you suspect that I am either in error
> or am being deceitful? At the very least, you should demand independent
> confirmation of my claim.
I appreciate you trying to create an analogy that you think I might find
relevant:-) But if you claimed this, how exactly could I expect to get
"independent confirmation" of your claim? Personally, I'd use 2 criteria in
consideration of your hypothetical claim. First, I'd take into consideration
you as a person. Are you truthful? But even in that case, I'd be limiting God
by not believing that God could chose to appear to even a compulsive liar, so
even that consideration is suspect. The best way I'd have to assess your claim
would be to consider the message itself. Does it jibe with the message of the
Gospel? Without more information as to the contents of the epiphany, I
wouldn't be able to say one way or the other whether I would believe you.
> Perhaps with this in mind you can comprehend Richard's skepticism;
> independent sources have failed to confirm Dubya's assertions, and now that
> independent (and potentially dissenting) review has been omitted, there's no
> reason to accept this sole confirming scientist's view, other than blind
> faith in Dubya.
Well, to quote from the article RM cited:
"What they've discovered," he [commander of the 101st Airborne Division] added,
"could prove to be of incalculable value. Though much work must still be done
to validate the information MET Alpha has uncovered, if it proves out it will
clearly be one of the major discoveries of this operation, and it may be the
major discovery."
It doesn't sound as if *anyone* is assuming that this 1 person's account is
Gospel-- it is merely a "lead" which requires more investigation.
It seemed to me, however, that RM has taken a rather biased view towards the
story. Since he has no faith in Bush or his administration, any evidence that
would support that administration is suspect, or even "planted". His cynicism
prejudges *any* evidence found-- why else even assert that *any* evidence would
be fabricated?
I suspect that *any* amount of evidence will be insufficient for RM, because he
has already concluded that Bush et al are wrong and deceitful, much in the same
way that no amount of evidence would prove to you that God exists (your epipany
included):
Given: Bush is wrong and deceitful
Hypothesis: Evidence is found to support that Bush is truthful and correct
Conclusion: Evidence is wrong or planted.
JOHN
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Message has 2 Replies:
 | | Re: WMD, again...
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| (...) Provide me with facts that disprove the "given" part -- prove to me that Bush is right and honest. I'm not seeing it on my own. -- Hop-Frog (21 years ago, 21-Apr-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
| | | Re: WMD, again...
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| (...) You could just ask me two different times... 8^) Anyway, you've given a nice summary of the problem of Revelation as evidence. Well said. (...) To let you (and myself) somewhat off the hook--part of my hypothetical situation was that Jesus (...) (21 years ago, 21-Apr-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: WMD, again...
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| (...) John--if I told you that the Risen Christ appeared to me, and that He proclaimed to me that Christians have been doing everything wrong for ~2000 years, would you believe me, or would you suspect that I am either in error or am being (...) (21 years ago, 21-Apr-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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