Subject:
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Re: Crazy, OK Heretical Idea ...
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.cad
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Date:
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Mon, 12 May 2003 21:13:23 GMT
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Viewed:
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1083 times
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In lugnet.cad, Steve Bliss writes:
> In lugnet.cad, Don Heyse wrote:
>
> > 0 Put the standard materials in P\MATERIAL.DAT
> > 0 MATERIAL DEFINE bumpy ......
> > 0 MATERIAL DEFINE smooth ......
> > 0 MATERIAL DEFINE rubber ......
> > 0 MATERIAL DEFINE metal ......
> > 0 MATERIAL DEFINE cloth ......
> > 0 MATERIAL DEFINE pearlescent ......
> > 0 MATERIAL DEFINE studLogoBumpMap ?????
> > 0 MATERIAL DEFINE printed ?????
>
> Yes, I think it would be good to not encode the materials in the
> rendering programs. There are always going to be new materials, just
> like LEGO keeps coming up with new colors.
>
> > 1 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 material.dat
> > 0 MATERIAL BEGIN bumpy
> > 0
> > 0 ordinary ldraw commands to draw a sloped face.
> > 0
> > 0 MATERIAL END bumpy
>
> That would work for some things, like bumpy surfaces on slopes, or
> rubber wheels. But for other things, like pearlescent materials, it
> wouldn't really be practical.
>
> The bumpy surface on a slope brick is always there -- it's an element of
> the part (or part of the element, either way).[2] But I don't think we
> want to support pearlescent finishes by defining a second copy of all
> the parts, where each copied file starts with MATERIAL BEGIN
> pearlescent, and ends with MATERIAL END. The same goes for
> chrome-plated versions parts, such as we've seen in the Creator sets.
>
> Pearlescent 'colors' *could* be handled in the model file, like:
>
> 0 MATERIAL BEGIN pearlescent
> 1 19 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 970c00.dat
> 0 MATERIAL END pearlescent
>
> But this approach gives something of a disconnect between the part and
> the matrial. I think users would tend to think of the pearlescence as
> part of the 'color' attribute. So, in this case, I would think it would
> be more natural to specify pearlescent as part of the 'color' code.
I see what you mean. We've actually started doing this for certain
materials such as gold, silver, chrome, and rubber. Ldview and
ldglite already tinker with the specular properties for some of these
materials based on the predefined color numbers. However, does
pearlescent material come in more than one color? Cloth, and bumpy
certainly do. I suppose we could set aside whole ranges of colors
for different materials like we do for the transparent colors.
> > Are printed textures a property of a MATERIAL, or should they be done
> > with a separate but similar set of meta-commands?
>
> If they're accomplished with the same code, they should probably use the
> same meta-command.
>
> One thing to keep in mind - bumpy slope surfaces could be considered an
> optional feature of a renderer. Printed decorations have to be
> supported by all renderers. So if we decide to enable a new way of
> coding patterns, it should be something that is relatively
> straightforward to implement.
My personal feeling is that the vector versions currently used for
printed decorations should still always be provided. The MATERIAL
or TEXTURE meta-command would just be an extra hint for more advanced
renderers to allow them to replace the block of vector drawn printing
with a single texture (possibly from a file) for speed.
> > > > My question is really on the technical side: I'm somewhat aware of the
> > > > technique of texture-mapping, but I don't know if that can be achieved
> > > > in renderers like LDLite (without major changes to the rendering
> > > > engine).
> > >
> > > This is a case by case issue, each program would need different changes to
> > > support it.
> >
> > If we implement it via meta-command hints then they can add the support
> > (or not) whenever they get around to it.
>
> Right. But is it something that can be done in a
> software-only-no-graphic-library program?
Yes. But if the vector represention (of printing) is still required to
be included in the part file then it doesn't have to be.
Don
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Crazy, OK Heretical Idea ...
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| (...) Yes, there's been several different pearlescents. Mostly in Bionicle products. Some of the colors include tan, gray, dark gray, and sand blue. The pearlescence appears (to my eye) to be mixed in throughout the material, not just a surface (...) (22 years ago, 14-May-03, to lugnet.cad)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Crazy, OK Heretical Idea ... [DAT]
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| (...) Yes, I think it would be good to not encode the materials in the rendering programs. There are always going to be new materials, just like LEGO keeps coming up with new colors. (...) That would work for some things, like bumpy surfaces on (...) (22 years ago, 10-May-03, to lugnet.cad)
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