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Has anyone considered tackling LDraw/LDLite as a Java Applet, maybe with controls for rotation? I hadn't really thought about the seriousness of it, until I saw this site: (URL) with a fully functional Sinclair ZX Spectrum being emulated on a web (...) (26 years ago, 24-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) it sounds like a good idea. definatly. i may give it a go sometime. (26 years ago, 24-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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[followups set to lugnet.cad.dev] (...) Steve! Whoa, heavy....like...WAY COOL IDEA!!!!! How come nobody's ever suggested this yet? (Or have they?) I mean, forget all about making a Mac clone of LDraw or any other specific platform -- even Linux -- (...) (26 years ago, 25-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad, lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Todd Lehman wrote in message ... (...) Why thank you =) (...) Indeed - I've got a guitar tabulature editor written entirely in Java and it runs as happily on a Win32 box as my friend's Linux box and apparently another friend's Mac. Rumour has it (...) (26 years ago, 25-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Also if it uses the Java3D api it would benefit from hardware acceleration and may run even faster than the current version on some machines. jonathan wilson a écrit dans le message ... (...) (26 years ago, 25-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) Another benefit of a Java version is that it's *much* easier to write networkable apps with Java than with C / C++. Parts updates can be automagically downloaded and installed from a "parts server"; alternatively, individual parts could be (...) (26 years ago, 25-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) How do you draw (pixels) in Java? Are there built-in functions, or would it require platform-specific code, or what? Or graphics library, perhaps? Steve (26 years ago, 25-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) It's surprisingly easy. Java actually doesn't suck! :) You just allocate a buffer, designate it as being a graphics buffer, and call functions to do graphics primitives. Here's an example -- not probably a great example because it's 3 years (...) (26 years ago, 25-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) It's probably even easier now, with the new 2D graphics API finished (1), and a 3D API in the works. I don't claim to know how these work (or even if they're useful for anything :-) but I've seen the 2D API favorably compared to the (...) (26 years ago, 25-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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WinCE's java support is really very poor. -gyug (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Might it be great in 12 months though? --Todd (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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I actually thought of this long ago and mentioned it to LDraw Master James himself. He didn't sound very interested in it at the time because he didn't think java was fast enough to support it. I sorta dropped the idea after that. I'm glad Todd made (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) standard (...) To me, that would be the primary advantage of a Java version[1], I haven't played with LDraw much because the biggest thing that put me off is the parts database, half the models I look at seem to have missing parts and when I (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Greg Williams wrote in message <36D6A432.8476B943@m...ng.com>... (...) features (...) done 3d (...) else's (...) for (...) As (...) free (...) Greg, this would be awesome. I think we need an option like this for Ldraw to really take off. Just think (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) I've though a bit about this -- I think I would prefer uncompressed individual files, as this would make parts updates easier on the server end. Just copy the /P and /PARTS dirs to the Web server. (1) <DEVILS_ADVOCATE> However, the JDK now has (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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I guess I'll be learning Java RSN. Anyone have a preference on what development tools to use? More important, any pointers to good learning tools (ie, books)? Thanks, Steve (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.off-topic.fun)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) Books: I would recommend Peter van der Linden's "Just Java", and / or (forget the author) "Core Java", as these are excellent tutorials with good code. (1) The O'Reilly book "Java Swing" is a very good introduction to the GUI libraries, but (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.off-topic.fun)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) Yes, definitely if as an app would you have all the files locally. I was talking about an applet that would not. You don't want to have to download the entire zip file every time because it would be fairly large. Having individually compressed (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) Why not serve both compressed and uncompressed versions? (...) Amen to that! Say, Greg, how's about posting the URL of your Blacktron Galaxy Explorer over in the .build group? Probably a lot of new-timers there who haven't seen it yet. (...) (...) (26 years ago, 26-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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[removed lugnet.cad from Newsgroups line] (...) I think the speed comparison depends on whether you use mod_perl or CGI+Perl or a specialized Perl HTTP daemon. Of course, if the code running on the server is Java, a Servlet is almost certainly the (...) (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) There is a servlet program plugin for Apache on Linux or NT at (URL) We're using the IIS version of it on NT. It is nice and speedy for java servlets. I assume the lugnet server is Linux. (...) Hmm... how long does it take ldlite to render an (...) (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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That would probably cut out the servlet possibility, then. There isn't a very good implementation of java for FreeBSD (no JIT), and I'm not sure about a Java Servlet implementation, either. (...) (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) No, it runs FreeBSD. (Not that there's anything wrong with Linux.) --Todd (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) Isn't there something you can do to have just *one* perl interpreter running, that does all the CGIing, instead of starting up all these processes? Jasper "can't imagine at what PID that server is by now" Janssen (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) aren't FreeBSD and Linux nigh-on binary-compatible, let alone cross-compilable? Jasper (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) You can use FastCGI ((URL) to have one process (or a fixed group of processes) serving CGI requests so you don't have the overhead of restarting the process (interpreter or otherwise) for each request. I used it for the Lego set database I (...) (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) There are also rumors that MS is going to drop Java++ alltogether. (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.off-topic.fun)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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[lugnet.cad removed from Newsgroups header] (...) Yes, it's fairly easy to write an HTTP daemon in Perl. Pre-forking and load balancing and shared memory for optimal usage is a little more difficult. But in either case, it's just a one-liner in the (...) (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) Don't know if I should laugh or cry... Jasper (26 years ago, 27-Feb-99, to lugnet.off-topic.fun)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Please before starting take a look at the java3D api, I know java 2 is not yet supported directly by most browsers but its just a question of time and then you have all the 3D done for you AND you get the benefice of 3D accelerations. Greg Williams (...) (26 years ago, 28-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Actually the 3D api is released, it works great and is fairly easy to use, I recomand it as far as parsing there are several parser generators for java out there. and the 3D api is hardware accelerated (it is written on top of opengl) Sproaticus a (...) (26 years ago, 28-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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If I use Java 2 I can use the latest API's with it. Because of the Java plugin that Sun produces, a browser can have that installed and always have the most up to date Java implementation. This is especially important since Netscape is no longer (...) (26 years ago, 28-Feb-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) An online database isn't going to completely address your two issues -- missing parts and parts which haven't been created. Typically, parts will be missing from a model either because (a) the parts aren't made yet (and it's actually problem (...) (26 years ago, 1-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) They'll probably introduce some clever coffee++ package, which is just the same thing, without any pretense of being compliant-able. Steve (26 years ago, 1-Mar-99, to lugnet.off-topic.fun)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) What happens when a part is move, with a moved_to file, and a model is loaded and edited? Does the editor save the _new_ part number, or the old? If you have it automatically saving the _new_ part number, you could make a ~moved_to file for (...) (26 years ago, 1-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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On my PPro150, LDLite has the following benchmarks: syntax example: ldlite_1_6.exe -MC -V3 car.dat Model Time ----- ---- car.dat 3.6 seconds wood4.dat 5.0 seconds (new syntax) bwing.dat 14.2 seconds (-S0.5) m928.dat 23.0 seconds (clipped) m928.dat (...) (26 years ago, 2-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) The editors I know of (LEdit and LDAO) don't automatically update moved parts. But it is a good idea that they should do so. I'm adding it to my list of suggestions. (...) It seems like someone (Lars? Tore? Leo?) wrote a program that would (...) (26 years ago, 2-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) That's me. (...) This only works for models in ldraw\models, but not for any in sub-directories. I'm not sure how one would go about automating the update of models in arbitrary directories. Cheers, - jsproat (26 years ago, 2-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) That would be a challenge -- there's no master list of all DATs on the system, so it would be a matter of searching the hard-drive, but only updating valid LDraw DAT files. Blech. There should (and may be) a utility that can clean up all files (...) (26 years ago, 2-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) Yep, it is ARJ. Specifically ARJ version 2.30. I don't recall anything about launching another program from the extractor in this version (which is pretty old) A quick search of the docs didn't turn up anything either. -- Terry K -- (26 years ago, 3-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev, lugnet.cad)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Talk is cheep. I spent the last couple of days trying to pound out a quick Java Ldraw program. Check out the results: (URL) as an Applet is way too slow. Its best to download jre and try it with that: (URL) that this is terribly buggy right now and (...) (26 years ago, 3-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) Could you possibly post the source code? Cheers, - jsproat (26 years ago, 3-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Hmm... I went back to the site and downloaded it, had no problems, but I was planning to put up the source code anyway. When it gets there, it'll be under (URL) wrote in message <36DDB71A.B1E74334@g...es.com>... (...) (26 years ago, 3-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) problems are you having with it? Cheers, - jsproat (26 years ago, 3-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) I think I'm 98% there -- I downloaded and installed the JRE and I have local copies of the jldraw.jar as you suggested, but when I do C:\LDRAW>"\program files\javasoft\jre\1.1\bin\jre" -cp jldraw.jar izzy.graphics.Tester I get the error (...) (26 years ago, 4-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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I got the source code and tried to compile it using Sun's Java. Unfortunately, the code is using proprietary Symantec widgets, so it won't compile. I wasn't able to get it to run using jre, either, Todd. You didn't do anything wrong. Using the JDK (...) (26 years ago, 4-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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I believe the only proprietary Symantec stuff (compiled versions of which should be in the jar, which I don't know why isn't working yet) is in a stupid error dialog, Dialog1.java, feel free to hack it to pieces. All of Symantec's components leaked (...) (26 years ago, 4-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Ah hah! The Xoom server is sending the wrong content-type for the jar file durring the HTTP conversation. The jar is not corrupted, but when downloading with a browser that doesn't know not to trust that content-type, it DOES get corrupted. I made a (...) (26 years ago, 4-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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Sproaticus wrote in message <36DDBF56.3E0556A@ge...es.com>... (...) Too many! The z buffering doesn't seem to be working quite the way I want, the quad code is just totally hacked together, I'm being way inefficient with memory, I know that I'm (...) (26 years ago, 4-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) I replaced the multiline label from symantec with a textarea with editing turned off to get similar functionality. That worked. Quite a few models cause out of memory exceptions if run using the default heap size in java. The default heap is (...) (26 years ago, 5-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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| | Re: Java LDraw/LDLite
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(...) (26 years ago, 29-Mar-99, to lugnet.cad.dev)
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