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(...) When a state says that a contract between a man and a woman has more standing or more importance, that is, that it is recognised as a special kind of contract, when compared to a contract between a man and a man or a man and two women (like i (...) (24 years ago, 14-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) State? I think you mean society. Scott A (24 years ago, 14-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) No, I'm sure he means State/Government. If you distil "society" (as you're referring to it here) down, it amounts to two forces: - market (in that if "society" frowns upon certain activities, there will be influence on cost/benefit analysis (...) (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) No. I wrote state because I meant state. Societies can't express preferences. Members of societes can (forcibly) *impose* their preferences on other members, through the mechanics of the state, but the society as a whole cannot have a (...) (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) Well, in the society I am part of polyamory and polygamy are not socially acceptable. Scott A (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) I think they can. (...) I accept that the majority in a society can implement change - we call it democracy. Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) You say "government" like it were an entity which just appeared after some sort of a coup. Here in the UK, the government exists "create an open and inclusive society, where rights are balanced with responsibilities, and where every citizen (...) (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) You're not paying attention, Scott. The very next paragraph explains why a society cannot express a preference. The majority of members can hold a preference and can use the organs of the state to impose their view, but a society, since it is (...) (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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Plowed ground alert. (...) For now. Subject to whim reversal, of course, since you have no mandated and irrevocable protections of your rights (neither do we, but ours are a bit harder to water down since they are in the Constitution, and the ones (...) (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) And your point is what, exactly? (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) In many ways, our rights are stronger than your own. It is true, I don't have the right to carry a gun to church - but I don't want it. Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) <larry snipped the rest of the text which explained the point I made - funny that> (...) My point is clear - nobody is forcing anyone to believe that polyamory and polygamy is not socially acceptable - the society I live has decided is not, (...) (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) Does a society not express a preference in a referendum? (...) I think you are putting words in my mouth Larry - and they are all the wrong ones. (...) I feel a little sorry for you Larry. You sound so bitter at what you feel your fellow man (...) (24 years ago, 15-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) Provide a cite please. That is, show how your set of rights are *harder to change* than ours, not that they currently give you more or less freedom. (1) That's the point I'm making, which you missed. 1 - they give you less, regardless of what (...) (24 years ago, 16-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) My point is "ploughed ground" Larry. (...) It takes >1 to debate Larry. Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 16-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) Funny, I don't recall you answering this question before. I *do* recall you dodging it, though... Provide a cite to where you provided a cite, then... ++Lar (24 years ago, 16-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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"Larry Pieniazek" <lpieniazek@mercator.com> wrote in message news:G5oqA2.9qK@lugnet.com... (...) to (...) freedom. (1) (...) you (...) I'm not going to do your homework for you again. If you are interested in my point - go find it. Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 17-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) You have never done it for me in the past, so "again" is an incorrect usage. The US has a constitution, which trumps individual laws. Laws have to theoretically be voted on separately, not just put in place by ministers subject to votes of (...) (24 years ago, 17-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) I'm genuinely flattered that you think that. However it's not true. It only takes one good debater (someone who knows how to think critically and who doesn't just *snipe*) to debate me, not an entire team. Perhaps you're starting to feel (...) (24 years ago, 17-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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"Larry Pieniazek" <lpieniazek@mercator.com> wrote in message news:G5pyGI.Dss@lugnet.com... (...) my (...) usage. Well, there was that time you were curious about my doctortate. (...) fiat (...) Not my point Larry. However, you are still wrong. Much (...) (24 years ago, 17-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) Which you never did answer, really. A one line answer was all that was required, but after about 5 tries, I finally dragged out of you that you're some kind of Civil, but not what kind. See, when I refuse to do homework for you, it's avoiding (...) (24 years ago, 18-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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You are wasting my time Larry. Go back and reply to my full text - do not conveniently delete text to suite _your_ point. This discussion is about a point I raised - do me the decency of answering it, rather than raising issues of your own - or (...) (24 years ago, 18-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) To have this charge come from you, the premier time waster of the entire .debate group, as everyone knows, is so laughable as to be beneath any further response. (...) We've had this discussion before, I am not going to reply to every snipe (...) (24 years ago, 18-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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<topped> (...) <tailed> Indeed. If you can not answer my points... there is no point. If you ever manage to get a response together, I'll re-enter this discussion with you. If you need me to explain myself further, perhaps I can draw you a picture - (...) (24 years ago, 18-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) When you actually manage to coherently make a point that hasn't already been answered in depth, do let us all know, won't you? I won't be holding my breath. All the points I could glean from your ramblings have been answered. Pity you can't (...) (24 years ago, 18-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) OK Larry. I'll play your game again. Let's revist this message: (URL) this text: =+= The point I was making about rights concerned political freedoms. For example - here in the UK one could always choose to be, say, a communist. Can you say (...) (24 years ago, 19-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) I'm not going to play yours though, or at least I'm going to try very hard not to. Too disruptive. If someone else wants to try, they are free to give it a go if they like, but I see it as a waste of effort. Me, I've got better uses for my (...) (24 years ago, 20-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) OK. That is, I think, the 3rd time you have abjectly failed to answer that point. I would have thought more of you if you had just not replied - rather than adopt this "holier than thou" attitude. I can't say I'm surprised though. Scott A (...) (24 years ago, 20-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Polyamory
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(...) I haven't failed to answer your point, I merely refuse to play your game. Think about the difference. (...) By the way, in order for me to be concerned about what a person thinks of me (in a particular area), I have to have respect for that (...) (24 years ago, 20-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | respect... (was Re: Polyamory)
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True to form Larry, you have resorted to personal insults. I think one of your countrymen once said: "When people do not respect us we are sharply offended; yet deep down in his private heart no man much respects himself." I largely agree with that (...) (24 years ago, 20-Dec-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Theory vs. practice (was Re: Polyamory
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All of what I say below is plowed ground, stuff I and others have said before, so those that pay attention are invited to skip this entire post. They already know this stuff. Scott, though, might want to pay attention, for once. I won't hold my (...) (24 years ago, 16-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Theory vs. practice (was Re: Polyamory
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(...) Balance snipped. Out of curiousity, Larry, do you think anyone other than you or Scott really cares about any of this? If it is all plowed ground, why post it all again? Is it so necessary for you to feel good about your debating technique (...) (24 years ago, 16-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Theory vs. practice (was Re: Polyamory
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(...) Wrong again. See: (URL) (...) Very interesting, but none of that answered my point: "In many ways, our rights are stronger than your own" I note that I was talking about actuality - not theory. But, again, you chose to squirm. Despite that, (...) (24 years ago, 16-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Theory vs. practice (was Re: Polyamory
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(...) As he enjoys playing to the crowd. (...) I _feel_ the contrary. I have promised many times to leave LP alone - if he does the same with me. However, I feel he just can't resist taking a shot at me. Look at this thread – the message he just (...) (24 years ago, 16-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Theory vs. practice (was Re: Polyamory
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(...) Is it necessary to make this a conditional promise? Can't each involved party rise to the moral high ground and ignore the other? (...) That comes from driving on the wrong side of the road and using that crazy metric system of yours. 8^) (...) (24 years ago, 16-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Theory vs. practice (was Re: Polyamory
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(...) Call it MAD (mutually assured destruction). (...) Ah Dave – very topical. Thirt years on, some of us Brits have still not went metric: Grocer trial told of 'metric threat' (URL) the US, you have your gun debate – we have this! Scott A (24 years ago, 16-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Theory vs. practice (was Re: Polyamory
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(...) After Scott beat me up for not answering it. Not just once or twice, either. Make up your mind, Scott, did you want it answered or not? ++Lar (24 years ago, 16-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Theory vs. practice (was Re: Polyamory
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(...) What are your thoughts on this? Are you willing to set aside your snide remarks? (...) Larry, It goes without saying that there many questions which on which I’d like to hear you opinions. Such as: (URL) I re-stated again the question to you (...) (24 years ago, 16-Jan-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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