Subject:
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Re: The beginning of the end of NATO?
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 12 Feb 2003 17:20:51 GMT
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Viewed:
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274 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek writes:
> This is awesome news... not only might this little war we're about to have
> finish up the UN as an active force, it might well do in NATO too.
>
> From the text of a speech by Senator John McCain (R., Ariz.) on February 8,
> 2003, at the Munich Conference on Security Policy before European Parliament
> and defense ministers: (available here, among other places:
> http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/comment-mccain021103.asp)
>
> - start -
>
> Iraq is the test that will determine whether the United States and Europe
> can rely on the founding charters of NATO and the U.N. Security Council to
> protect their most fundamental security interests--or whether we have
> entered an age in which security is pursued by other means. Should great
> powers determine that multilateral institutions such as NATO and the
> Security Council cannot protect their interests when they are imperiled,
> countries will increasingly be tempted to go it alone rather than relying on
> international institutions that shrink from their mission of upholding
> international security. The United States might succeed in such an
> environment, though I hate to contemplate it, but many nations, including
> many in Europe, will not.
Fomenting a war between Turkay and Iraq and then demanding that everyone aid
in the war that they opposed being started in the first place will not be a
feather in Bush's cap. All he will do is drive a wedge between us and the
rest of NATO, effectively giving up leverage. It is a give-and-take
organization: we may be able to ask a lot, but at some point you can go over
the edge on the "take" part. I think Bush is abusing the NATO pact on this
particular angle.
At the same time, if the UN makes half-hearted sham "inspections" then it
does encourage nations to go it alone (or in the case of Dubya, surrenders
to him the moral fig leaf he is looking for, but be that as it may, it still
is the failing of the UN).
>
> - end -
>
> He's right. The US is now that much closer to dismissing NATO as something
> to care about.
The question of NATO being superfluous with the collapse of the Warsaw Pact
nations has been there for a long time. But NATO has remaind so far because
it is an acknowledgement of the common interests the various nations share.
>
> Just as I predicted earlier in this very forum, the leaders of France and
> Germany are going to let Turkey get attacked by Iraq just to spite the US
> rather than work within NATO to take precautions, even when explicitly asked
> by Turkey for aid. Apparently Turkey's invocation of Article IV of the NATO
> charter isn't up to France's dainty standards?
France not been even a half-hearted backer of NATO for a long time now. I
don't expect much out of France (they are still sulking over our not backing
them in Viet Nam).
>
> Let's pull our troops out of Germany and base them where they're more welcome.
>
> Or, better, bring them home.
That just makes sense anyway, regardless of what decision NATO makes on this.
-->Bruce<--
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: The beginning of the end of NATO?
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| (...) Ya. I for one would LOVE to see some real investigative reporting into the theory that France is blocking things because they have lots and lots of business deals in the hopper that would go forward if sanctions are eventually lifted but which (...) (22 years ago, 13-Feb-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | The beginning of the end of NATO?
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| This is awesome news... not only might this little war we're about to have finish up the UN as an active force, it might well do in NATO too. From the text of a speech by Senator John McCain (R., Ariz.) on February 8, 2003, at the Munich Conference (...) (22 years ago, 12-Feb-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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