Subject:
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Re: Violence in comics (was Re: A General Question About Castle World)
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 24 Jul 2000 19:58:44 GMT
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Viewed:
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902 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Andrew Krug writes:
> While I hate to continue this discussion on Comic Books here, for lack of
> anywhere else to go I will.
That's what lugnet.off-topic.debate is for. :D
> I am well aware that Captain America is
> hardly "non-violent", yet I can also say that in the many years I've been
> reading his comics I can think of maybe 1 or 2 times he has actually killed
> anyone! He usually avoids extreme violence (aka. DEATH) whenever he can and
> usually goes to great pains to make sure he doesn't kill anyone (often hurting
> himself and his cause).
Ah. Well, ok, that is very different from "non-violent".
Even so, there are certainly comics that *are* very violent (see Garth Ennis'
current 12-part Punisher storyline)- but they actually seem to be few and far
between now. I know there was a period when it was all the rage, but after
reading a long run of Wolverine (I started when Erik Larsen took over writing)
I have seen very few *deaths*. And Wolverine is often touted as being
uber-violent.
Of course, that is very different from a Captain America or a Batman or a
Superman, who goes out of their way to *avoid* killing someone, where they make
it an issue that they are avoiding lethality.
> I think most kids today (read that teens or whatever
> age comic book buyers usually are) think that is just a little too quaint and
> not very exciting.
Actually, there has been a bit of a backslide recently. Dark, brooding
characters (not necessarily violent- one can be a cheerful homicidal maniac or
a brooding peacenik) were all the rage for a while, but not so much anymore.
> All the American Flag, Mom, and Apple Pie stuff in the
> Captain Amercia comics just doesn't seem as appealing to kids as some dark
> brooding hero with lots of physcological problems (like Wolverine). That's
> not to say that those comics are bad, just not my cup of tea.
And, of course, your opinion is perfectly valid and you're entitled to it. I
happen to just like well-written books, whether they involve brooding
characters or happy ones. I know that Cap is being written by, um, is it
Busiek or Waid right now?- and that has tempted me to buy it (I like both
writers, I just can't keep straight the books they write that I'm not reading).
The "apple pie" angle can certainly be written in a very intriguing style,
although I think it can be badly hacked and trite.
Of course, I also beleive that characters like the Punisher can be written in a
totally unreadable style. It's difficult to make a man with an M-16
interesting month after month.
> I'm also not saying that comics shouldn't be violent, but my idea of violence
> is more like punching, wrestling, and good hand to hand fighting, not Punisher
> style shoot everyone in sight.
There are many people who would readily agree with you. The Punisher's move
from Spiderman *villian* to popular antihero was the beginning of a really
weird age for comics- one that saw characters like Cable, etc. There are
plenty of people who would agree that they are *not* superheroes- and I
actually agree wholeheartedly.
> I just think with all the violence in the
> world today comic books could probably afford to be a little more creative in
> how they use their violence considering kids are supposed to be the major
> readers of comic books (although I suppose you and I are proof that isn't
> always the case).
Heh. Yeah, actually, I think that most comic companies now actively peg males
age 12-25 as their main targets (and I think we both fall outside those
bounds). I can't remember the last time I saw a kid in my favorite comic store
buying *comics* as opposed to Pokemon cards. :D
> As an Army Officer I certainly have no problem with
> violence when needed but as a father I don't know how much of that we need to
> expose our kids to when not necessary. Just one guy's point of view though.
Well, I certainly agree that parents should keep a close eye on kids to be sure
that they understand the difference between fantasy and reality- and, of
course, there are themes that aren't appropriate for certain ages.
> I haven't seen any of the Kingdom Come stuff yet, perhaps I'll have to check
> it out.
I think if you read it as an allegory for what happened in the field of
superhero characters- as well as just a really cool story with amazing artwork-
you'll really enjoy it, based on what you've expressed here. It should be
available as a collection in a specialty shop. Even if it's in hardback, it's
worth it- trust me. :D
> Thanks for your thoughts.
And thanks for yours!
eric
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