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(...) Oh, you mean in the way that he was in and out of prison like spinning in a turnstyle? (...) Wrong. Stops him from ever doing it again. (...) What is it with you Liberals? What is there to understand? Evil is evil. Stop trying to understand it (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Which part of the teachings of Christ are you reflecting...I can't seem to find that part. Chris (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) But, John, the death penalty is, so, well, final. What if there was a mistake? It does happen, you know. Even in these apparently close and shut cases, with "confessions" and neat surveilance videotapes and everything. What if the prison (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Well, I did start the post with " Which is probably why I shouldn't be allowed to get one... " See, when the emotions get involved, can one really make a rational decision where life is concerned. I don't know what's the right thing to do. If (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Maybe this one: "I will strew your flesh on the mountains, and fill the valleys with your carcass. I will drench the land with your flowing blood up to the mountains, and the watercourses will be filled with you." Eze 32:5-6 or this one: "Now (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Dude, I am imperfect and this is an imperfect world. Somehow, I believe he will come to full judgment for his actions, but probably not in this world. The closest thing I could think of to a fitting judgment here on earth would be to condemn (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Well it should be pointed out that those are Old Testament books and while Christ never repudiated them he didn't exactly go around saying they were spot on as moral guides given the new relationship of god with man that was represented by the (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) But if we are not outraged when atrocities occur, we are morally doomed. (...) How would it be unjust? Showing him the same mercy he showed seems just to me. The injustice is that there is a family whose lives have been completely shattered (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Woudn't that be like asking Dr J to do a PSA on abstinance? ;-) JOHN (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them." Matthew 5:17 I remember my mother quoting that to me. And I also remember in the next breath that she said, "And then he (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) I'm not so sure. While I still hold on my faith, I find it deeply distrubing that the atrocities ordered by God in the Old Testament are not reputiated in the teachings of Jesus since Jesus is God. In fact, I find it hard to accept that a God (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Well, I think he did both. He was the Messiah, the hope and King of the Jews, so in that respect he fulfilled the Law and Prophecies. He also introduced a New Covenant, but I would disagree that it superceded the original covenant God made (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) I have the same problem, but after having read The Great Divorce by CS Lewis, I have come to as close an understanding as I think I will ever come WRT Hell. His basic premise is that we of our own free will choose Hell, not God condemning us (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) I lean towards the Seventh Day Adventist teachings in that death is a sleep during which the "dead know nothing" (Eccl 9:5), which is to say that nothing of a person survives death, that the dead simply cease to exist until they are (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) I understand that, but aren't you supposed to try? I mean, you're openly embracing your desire to torture another man. I thought (and obviously I don't hold the same set of spiritual convictions that you do, but I thought I understood them a (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | A PSA on abstinence from Dr J
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(...) Hi-ho. (...) Yes, you might think that if Jesus, as God-on-earth (or at least someone-more-qualifi...s-behalf), wanted it to be clear to people in his own time (and for all time) that the barbaric morality which the Old Testament portrays as (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) What I was trying to do was emphathize with the parents of this little girl. I was imagining that it happened to my little girl. So yeah, my reaction was a little personal and over the top. I don't think Dave or I would be justified to torture (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) And if we stoop to the level of the atrocity committer in our meting out of justice, we are also so doomed. (...) Assuming he did it. I grant it looks pretty certain but never can you be 100% CERTAIN. Do you know for *sure* what exactly (...) (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Not really. He certainly knows the bible better than I do, and perhaps even better than you do, John... (21 years ago, 8-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Of course, but even if we tortured and killed a known torturer and killer, it still wouldn't be morally equivalent to the torturing and killing of an innocent. And BTW, what IS justice for a known kidnapper and murderer of innocent children? (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Perhaps, if he were a Religion major in kollege (as I was). And BTW, I meant Wilt Chamberlain, not Dr J (I guess I got them confused because of Dr J's recent legal problems with his estranged wife...) JOHN (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) I see no reason for cable TV or conjugal visits. Life in prison sounds about right though. (I beleive you asked this already) Note, again, my assertion that prisons need to be structured so that they do not cost the state money, but rather, (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) HA, don't let the Libs hear you say that;-) (...) But herein lies the rub. Does the punishment fit the crime? A 3 time drug abuser can get about the same length sentence (depending upon the ages of the criminals-- hey, life is only so long). (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Why? I would have thought all you Cons (of one ilk or another) stuck together anyway. ;-) -->Bruce<-- (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) It is hard for me to see how prison could be zero cost. Criminals tend to on the dim side and have low earning potential. How could one motivate them to work without rewarding them with (say) cable TV? In the UK, the cost of keeping a man (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Wow, this is an interesting idea. Maybe this is what was meant by "an eye for an eye..." Part out the death row inmates to save other lives. Something King Solomon would appreciate, I'm sure. - Chris. (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) You're right, it's not. A 3 time drug "abuser" hasn't necessarily committed any actual crime at all, so shouldn't be in jail for his/her "crime". I'm glad to see you've decided to come to the side of the angels and oppose the war on drugs, at (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Not my original idea. Try googling using Niven and Corpsicle as search terms... also try Gil Hamilton, ARM and Patchwork Girl. Note that it's not Niven's original idea either, I don't think. (at least the frozen corpse part of it anyway) (...) (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) The idea of using desth row prisoners as "parts" was explored in a SciFi story by Larry Niven (can't remeber the name). The hypothesis of his story was that if the condemed were used for parts, then over time, more and more crimes would become (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Hey, keep those puns in specified areas! (good one:-) JOHN (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) My whole point is so what? An innocent get killed. Your idea releases a killer and he kills again. Both result in an innocent killed. What's the difference? (...) What were you saying about torture? On second thought; maybe we have a win-win (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Several, actually... you and I were posting at about the same time and I gave some suggestions for finding them. (...) There IS that tiny downside, yes. Hence another reason to oppose the death penalty. (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Lester Witter wrote: <snip> (...) It was also used in "Lexx" the miniseries... THough in that series, iirc, almost any offence got you put up on the slab to be parsed (even being late for work!), and, again iirc, much (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) I fixed it, there is something there now if you click that ersatz link. :-) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) You want the state to do it, that's the difference. (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) So you think that the state isn't in any way culpable for the murder of an innocent by a murderer who has been set free? (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Didn't say that. In fact I do think there is culpability, if it can be shown that the state did not do its job in prosecuting the case. I can see the basis for a civil suit by the second victims against the cops that failed to properly (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) releases a (...) the (...) You're speaking as if the only alternative to the death penalty is letting people free. If you can show me with reasonable certainty that a given person is a danger to society, then I am willing to put them in prison (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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"lester Witter" <witter@erim-int.com> wrote in message news:HstoCt.1xzx@lugnet.com... (...) story (...) that if (...) would (...) man was (...) This is definitely a concern. I think I would be concerned even if it was done in such a way as to not be (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) money, (...) their (...) work? (...) Hmm, I might still let them have slop... I would offer a variety of incentives. I don't see a problem with prisoners who are on their way to rehabilitation having access to TV and such. In fact, if they are (...) (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Would you prefer your child to be wrongly executed by a court or murdered by some psycho? Chris (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) Neither. But the results are the same aren't they? JOHN (21 years ago, 9-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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(...) (URL) I suppose they can...> ROSCO (21 years ago, 10-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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