 | | Re: Once again, even with all our problems, Canada--a great place to live...
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Hi all, it's been a while! The subject of this post seems curious to me. Canada is a great place...why? Dave, are you reacting to the court's decision or to this journalist's gushing? The way I see it, the writing in that piece was sub par in that (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Once again, even with all our problems, Canada--a great place to live...
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(...) What makes the court decision remarkable is that they actually made a decision that's rational, instead of politically expedient. You may have found the writing sub-par, but then you may not know the actual author of the article, Rachel Sa. (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) Careful there, Chris... he's been seen going around asserting that the sun rises in the east again. (...) er, oops. Nevermind. :-) Now, a bit more on track, we're not much on hitting our kids, and we didn't, much, especially now that both of (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) You can't reason with a horse. (...) You can't reason with a cat. (...) You can reason with a child. Parenthood can be very difficult. However, I can't see how resorting to violence will give a parent anything other than short-term gain and (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) You can, however, teach a horse. (...) You can, however, teach a cat (...) A 5 year old, as Larry mentioned, throwing a tantrum, as far as my personal experience goes, is pretty much unreasonable, and will either stop the tantrum when a) (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) There are two basic thrusts that I'll take with this. First, and what I expect to me more convincing/interesting to the "pro-spank" or "parents' rights" crowd, is that it produces long-term deleterious motivational effects. It seems that (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Christopher L. Weeks wrote: <snip lots of weel thgouht out and implemented stuff> (...) Wow Chris, that's a whole different slant that I hadn't considered. Nicely done. To continue the discussion with maybe a specific (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) Honestly considering tantrums is a somewhat humbling experience for parents. You can pretty explicitly track the cause of the tantrum to failure to act on the part of the parents. I've been there and done that. It's been my fault. It might be (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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> But it's not neccessary. The last time I advocated something like this here, (...) desire (...) not (...) behavior (we (...) our (...) I was there also. I was impressed with the visible results of your parenting. I had one eye opening experience (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) One can produce a conditioned response if that is what you mean. I'm not sure the horse (or cat) has understood much else? (...) I, and many others, manage by doing neither. How do you explain that? My kids understand they will not benefit (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) With respect, it is seldom the case that "simply asking" will result in getting one's way. Why don't you ask your boss to double your salary and increase your benefits? Will you get your way? I grant you, throwing a tantrum probably won't (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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Dave, I'm thinking that you are nit-picking by way of purposely failing to read between the lines. If I'm wrong, then I must have communicated rather poorly. If you take a minute to evaluate my notes and your response, and then think that your (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) Hey, don't get all reasonable on me now! I can cut through my verbosity and sum it up this way: 1. I dispute the assertion that verbal instruction is generally sufficient to steer a recalcitrant child away from ultimately self-damaging (...) (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler wrote: <snip> (...) You leave my Canadian teets alone! <snip> (...) Dave K (21 years ago, 4-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) sufficient to (...) behavior is (...) I don't think Chris has ever said that. Now I may be shortcutting Chris's recent posts, but I know in the past that Chris has said that if a kid was about to run in front of a car, he would grab the kid. (...) (21 years ago, 5-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) Agreed. Once the child has become recalcitrant, simple, calm reason is often a waste. I like to look at the child's recalcitrance the same way I look at crime, though, and try to prevent it rather than merely responding. A healthy dose of Good (...) (21 years ago, 5-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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What follows is not my best writing... I used a lot of that up today working on deliverables for my client and for BrickFest PDX. But it's a great topic and I wanted to take one more swing before I went to bed... (...) I know Chris didn't completely (...) (21 years ago, 5-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) It is improbable, but not impossible. Surely, the key must then be that you should have the respect of your kids before you encounter your extreme life-or-death scenario? We don’t share the same culture or kids, but for me beating children is (...) (21 years ago, 5-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) I went to bed thinking about this last night. I think I've overstated my agreement. Do you think the notion of personal responsibility (as a valuable more) is "at its essence arbitrary?" I am led to my parent/child debt structure by the twin (...) (21 years ago, 5-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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Larry, I did think that Nik was a courteous young man. And I don't mean to suggest that you can not get acceptable, even good, results in turning a child into an adult with corporal punishment as a tool. I was spanked. I'm OK. But I do question how (...) (21 years ago, 5-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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Must have been a big couch! How did your nephew lead into the fit without reminding you of what he was seeking? I think I'm not getting part of the situation. Also, what would have been his alternative sleeping arangements? Was it eye-opening only (...) (21 years ago, 5-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) Yes, though I remember things being a bit crowded, but obviously the only way I was remotely going to get any sleep was to share the couch... (...) have (...) I don't remember many details. I was trying to put him to bed in his room. I'm (...) (21 years ago, 5-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Corporal punishment (was rah rah, canada!
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(...) Nuts to that. I have you on record agreeing with me, so that's the end of it! 8^P (...) Not personal responsibility, but the particular framing of the parent/child contract. Larry gave a better alternative breakdown than I provided, so I'll (...) (21 years ago, 5-Feb-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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