Subject:
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Re: Lego seems to be copying Mega Blocks
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 24 May 2004 22:46:49 GMT
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Viewed:
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1505 times
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The “pocket battleships” (literally Panzerschiffen, or armor-clads)
you’re thinking of were Deutschland (later Lützow), Admiral Graf Spee
(of the River Plate, and which a private company is talking about raising and
restoring (!!!!)), and Admiral Scheer.
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Doh! Right you are! My mistake. The Gneisenau and Scharnhorst were
definitely of the battle cruiser type vessel, in that they were built in
response to the Invincibles and later Indefatigables. Interestingly, the
Germans never really fully embraced the battle cruiser name, simply refering to
them as armored cruisers or large cruisers.
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Considering that the best evidence suggests that Prinz Eugen
sank Hood
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That has been adequately proven (at least to me) by the fire control logs of the
Prinz Eugen. The poor Bismark, she and the Tirpitz suffered fates much
less admirable then they deserved.
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I just tend to think that the designation is very subjective, but the
Kriegsmarine’s intent was certainly that all after the three pocket
battleships were to be fully-fledged capital ships and form part of the “Z”
plan put together by Zenker long before the war (and, in its early stages,
before the Nazi assumption of power).
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And I was actually making a stab at the modern navy for their simplified version
of classifications. I guess I just long for the diverse navies of WWII.
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I would have liked to have seen those ships, just for the sheer weirdness
value. They were oddities on the scale of Fisher’s “Large Light Cruisers”
Courageous, Glorious and Furious
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Ah, now those ships were bizarre indeed, especially once they began the
conversion to aircraft carriers. In fact, Fisher wanted the Furious for a
joint amphibious operation with the Russians across the Baltic and armed her
with two 18” guns. At one point in her life, she actually carried her bow 18”
gun while her stern was converted for carrier ops. Very unique.
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understanding is that the Alaskas were designed as pre-emptive “responses”
to a Japanese 12-inch-gunned “raider” class
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True, that was one of the reasons FDR and his supporters passed the Alaskas.
There was also the supposed threat of German surface commerce raiders, but even
as early as the initial Alaska designs were being drawn up, that threat was
non-existant.
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under its suggested design would actually have outclassed the Alaskas
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Well, the ‘outclassing’ is a weird thing when refering to Japanese vessels and
needs to be taken with a grain of salt. The Japanese were notorious for
building super-armored vessels i.e. the Yamato. However, their armor design
was somewhat flawed, in that they could not produce large enough sheets of armor
and had to rivet smaller ones together. This caused very accute weak points
along the lines of rivets.
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They weren’t the only battlecruisers ever designed for the US Navy of course;
Lexington and Saratoga were originally “CC” in designation, though what
“CC” actually signified literally I cannot imagine. I think it is the only
case in which a ship designation type actually shrank in terms of the
tonnage of its classes.
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Actually, in the August 1916 Naval Building Plan, the 6 Lexingtons were
supposed to constructed along with 10 Scout Cruisers. The CC was apparently a
new classification for a Heavy Scout Cruiser. The General Board of the Navy
wanted to utilize the Lexingtons at least in basic mission as Scout fleets in
support to the main battle fleet. This is possibly in reaction to the poor
performance of the Invincible and the other British battle cruisers at
Jutland.
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Likewise; sadly, there’s not a “lugnet.off-topic.discussion.naval-wonks” or
I’d be there all the time.
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Perhaps we should start one. . .
Steve
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Lego seems to be copying Mega Blocks
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| (...) I think they did actually use Schlachtkreuzer at some point-- Breyer at least suggests that they did, but you do see Panzerkreuzer and Grosser Kreuzer used as well. (Imagine the s-tsett there, I cannot remember the ANSI number for it.) But it (...) (20 years ago, 25-May-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Lego seems to be copying Mega Blocks
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| (...) The "pocket battleships" (literally Panzerschiffen, or armor-clads) you're thinking of were Deutschland (later Lützow), Admiral Graf Spee (of the River Plate, and which a private company is talking about raising and restoring (!!!!)), and (...) (20 years ago, 24-May-04, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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