 | | Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?]
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(...) No, in other words, you're not moving this discussion forward because you're not doing what you committed to do, accept my premise and try to refute this particular point using it. We have a fundamental disagreement about rights. I happen to (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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Matt, (...) Yes, but without the Declaration, we would have no Constitution, or Bill of Rights. Clearly the intent of the Founding Fathers is here.. but this isn't what I was talking about. (...) I think that the Constitution outlined the concept of (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) Yes. And I proceeded to tersly show that even if you buy ends justify the means you still fail, because you get bad ends. all government programs produce bad results is my utilitarian thesis. So I have him both ways. (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Swearing?
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(...) Just for the record, I fully agree. Jasper (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Swearing?
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(...) Because it is _bad_ art. Not because it's not art. Jasper (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?]
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(...) In other words, "neener neener, I can't hear you?" Whatever. Jasper (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Swearing?
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(...) No. (...) I'm not saying you can't judge it. I'm saying you can't say it isn't art, but that doesn't at all preclude you from saying it's _bad_ art. (...) The definition doesn't exist, short of an inclusive data base. Jasper (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) "utilitarian" == "ends justify the means", no? Jasper (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) You discredit yourself completely in the first sentence. Nice going. "coined by the founding fathers" == "god-given". Whatever. (...) So now it's a bad idea to strive for utopia? Jasper (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) They don't get incented. (...) Noone. Except possibly, oh, I don't know, how about those people who could actually benefit from the invention? You know, just like roads should be financed by the users. And please don't come shouting about how (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) He also spoke against slavery, but didn't even free his slaves in his will. (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) Yes. The Declaration of Independence is very much not the Constitution. In fact, interesting to consider that this language, so obvious in the declaration, is so conspicuously not in the constitution. (...) Yes. Foundationalism is nice, when (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) ___...___ Scott E. Sanburn-> ssanburn@cleanweb.net Systems Administrator/CAD Operator-Affiliated Engineers -> (URL) Page -> (URL) Page -> (URL) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) I'm not saying anything about justifying anything. "Ends justify the means" implies some sort of need for justificiation, and as I said, I'm assuming neither a totally evil government nor totally evil capitalists. (...) Not true. They may not (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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<387424BA.8AA8A11@voyager.net> <slrn8797ta.341.matt...ia.bu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (...) Well, this doesn't narrow it down a lot, because the entire thread is still 400+ posts, but if you (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) Well, it speaks (Looking at my CATO supplied Constitution & Bill of Rights) , "the separate and equal Station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God...." for one (In the Declaration of Independence). The concept of natural law, in (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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<38741B0A.4F62FC4B@c...anweb.net> <slrn879752.341.matt...ia.bu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (...) Yes. Unless you're a big fan of "the ends justify the means". Good outcomes do not justify (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Swearing?
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(...) But this, too, is circular, since your question implies that a human being who doesn't say "That's sick!" is not normal and decent. Dave! (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) Fair enough -- I admit to joining the debate in progress. There's several thousand posts in this newsgroup; discussing them all becomes an ever-increasing burden to entry. Could you point me to several in particular that you'd like me to (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Goodness of Man? (was: Re: Merry Christmas from the Libertarian Party
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(...) Yeah. But I disagree. The founding fathers may have had this belief, but they very carefully didn't write it into the constitution. (...) So if the government does something good, it's still evil? I guess I'm concerned with making things work. (...) (25 years ago, 6-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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