 | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | (...) OK, it's as voluntary as anything ever is. I don't feel responsible to make things better than they can be. (...) Well, I don't think anyone is harmed - unless I spend so much that I can't buy groceries. So the net benefit of the transactions (...) (25 years ago, 18-Oct-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —John DiRienzo
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| | | | | Christopher Weeks wrote in message <380B0F8D.112B4FA6@e...se.net>... (...) may (...) it (...) given (...) road, (...) I gotta agree - if somebody dies because of a person's actions, whether intended or not, they are still dead. Instead of locking (...) (25 years ago, 26-Oct-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | | (...) Taking this remark out of the post.. So what you're saying is, someone, not the state, should have the right to decide that a) someone is guilty b) that the crime deserves death c) that he has the right to do this. So essentially, a random (...) (25 years ago, 11-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Frank Filz
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| | | | | (...) As I understand what Larry has been saying, and from my own thinking, I do not believe that the position held by Christopher is a Libertarian position (but I may be wrong). (25 years ago, 11-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —John DiRienzo
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| | | | | | Frank Filz wrote in message <382AD2AD.1587@minds...ng.com>... (...) Frank, I think you are right. What Christopher is saying sounds a little anarchist or something, but definitely not Libertarian. -- Have fun! John The Legos you've been dreaming (...) (25 years ago, 12-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | | | | (...) Same thing. And just as silly. Jasper (25 years ago, 17-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | (...) Jasper, stop trolling. :-) We've discussed what Libertarianism is and isn't in some depth, and you know darn well that it is not anarchy or anything like it. (25 years ago, 17-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | | | (...) What else would I do on sunday nights? ;) (...) The longer I think about it (and speak to some slightly more hardcore libertarians over on other places), the harder it gets for me to distinguish (hardcore) libertarianism from anarchism. The (...) (25 years ago, 17-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Scott Edward Sanburn
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| | | | | | | (...) (25 years ago, 18-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Scott Edward Sanburn
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| | | | | | Sorry, I wanted to write something, decided not to, and hit the wrong button. Scott S. (...) (25 years ago, 18-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | Sorry, I've been gone for a week. I had to go back and read what I was talking about to address this. (...) It's much easier for you to do what you want with it that way, right? (...) Well, first, it was kind of a flippant remark, and second, no. I (...) (25 years ago, 17-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | (...) It's also good netiquette. (...) If you come home, find someone there, and shoot him, you have shot down an innocent man and therefore deserve to be punished. That is what "innocent until proven guilty" means. (...) The US. Socialist. Please, (...) (25 years ago, 18-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Dave Schuler
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| | | | | (...) Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but I'm having trouble getting my head into the space you're describing. Let me try a different example to see if I understand your position: Suppose someone is in the process of stabbing you in the chest with the (...) (25 years ago, 18-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | | | (...) ^^^^ (...) Only is the key word here. In the case I was responding to, there were other options. At least, I read it as such. Jasper (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Dave Schuler
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| | | | | | (...) Whew! Gosh gosh gosh, I don't know. I'm afraid I'm having difficulty keeping my knee-jerk response separate from my intellectual one. What if, in the earlier example, the rape victim fought off her attacker, and in the process killed him? Who, (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | | | (...) Who doesn't? (...) Short answer: I dunno. That bit requires much further thought. (...) Yeah, it is. Jasper (25 years ago, 20-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Mike Stanley
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| | | | | | Message-Id: <slrn83cdbc.bqp.cjc@...s.utk.edu> User-Agent: slrn/0.9.5.4 (UNIX) (...) Hunh? Rape ought to be a capital crime anyway, but if a rape victim, as in someone who is at that moment being raped, fights off her rapist and kills him in the (...) (25 years ago, 20-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | | | (...) No, it oughtn't. That's another discussion, but it does colour my thoughts here. (...) _If_ there is any proof that there was, in fact, a rape goping on. The situation isn't what makes it gray, it's what can be made to look like the same (...) (25 years ago, 20-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Frank Filz
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| | | | | | | Jasper Janssen wrote in message <383e047e.247832761@...et.com>... (...) attacker, and (...) Please note: my discussion below is not intended to diminish the impact of rape or attempted rape on anyone. Something to ponder in thinking about rape as a (...) (25 years ago, 21-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania... —Mike Stanley
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| | | | | | (...) Nope, sorry. That sounds like something you'd hear on The Practice or some other lawyer show. Rape doesn't (normally) occur as a result of miscommunication. I can't speak for everyone, but even the times when I've had what some might call (...) (25 years ago, 21-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Frank Filz
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| | | | | (...) I think I'll drag out an example which by your legal code I suspect I would not be able to drag out because I would be dead... Several years ago, I was driving home from Thanksgiving, and had had a frustrating drive (try losing your alternator (...) (25 years ago, 18-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Simon Robinson
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| | | | | | | (...) I'm curious. Just out of interest - don't you have anything in the States equivalent to the UK's AA or RAC? (You pay a fee - anything from about £40 ($60) per year upwards then whenever you break down anywhere, someone will come out to fix it. (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | | | (...) Wrong. (...) Yikes! (...) In what way was that not bright? I think you behaved correctly - unless you were overly aggressive. (...) Wow, that's pretty dramatic. I've been a clerk at a gas station and we had a button that called the cops in (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | | (...) Sorry, I meant that as a joke. I should have included emoticons ;-) (...) Well....I disagree. But he was proven guilty. He proved it to me by raping my wife. Under your world view, what would be the appropriate response to finding yourself in (...) (25 years ago, 18-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | | | (...) He was proven guilty to you because you saw him. When was it that you said "I don't want to play judge, jury, and executioner"? Oh, right, four messages up. (...) I'd probably start off by grabbing a poker and trying to beat him senseless. (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | | | | (...) If you're going to quote me, please have the decency to do so accurately. I said "I wouldn't say that anyone (or everyone) should have the right to be judge, jury, and executioner." That statement means that I do not support a system of (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | | | | | (...) Sorry about that. I figured it was a fairly accurate representation of what you said. (...) I agree, absolutely. (...) True. But I'd still like to see at least an attempt made to do it via the legislated channels first - mostly because of the (...) (25 years ago, 20-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —John Neal
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| | | | | | (...) Uh, we don't *know* that. Figures please. -John (...) (25 years ago, 20-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Scott Edward Sanburn
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| | | | | (...) Well, why did you cause such a ruckus at an attendant? If the hose was leaking, and there was a problem, I would have pointed it out in a polite manner, regardless if I had a really bad day or not. I would have stopped the pump, told the (...) (25 years ago, 18-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Frank Filz
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| | | | | | (...) Perhaps I should have clarified what I did a little better. I didn't start out to cause a ruckus, but it is hard to be totally polite when you're tired and way past ready to be home and in bed. I think I started by pointing out in a reasonably (...) (25 years ago, 18-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Jasper Janssen
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| | | | | | (...) Pulling a bloody _gun_ on someone because you believe he may trying to cheat you out of a few dollars of gas is _not_ lawsuit material? Sheesh. And I thought you could sue for virtually anything (and epxect to win) in the US system.. ;) (...) (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Frank Filz
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| | | | | | (...) I wasn't meaning that wouldn't be lawsuit material in todays world. I was meaning it shouldn't be lawsuit material. At least in todays world of holdups etc. his actions were NOT unreasonable. He also never AIMED the gun at me (just made it (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | <38344C17.6EF@mindspring.com> <FLFAC8.B34@lugnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit (...) We don't have very many widely available plans that generous. However, we DO have a number of plans that offer (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | | | (...) Right. Plans like Larry describes are common as dirt. (...) AAA+ will tow you up to 100 miles and costs about $90 per year. If you drive very much (I do) then it is well worth it. Even new cars can have problems. Chris (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Frank Filz
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| | | | | <38344C17.6EF@mindspring.com> <FLFAC8.B34@lugnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit (...) Unfortuanately at that time I didn't have AAA. Now I do. I'm not sure that they would have gotten my car fixed (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: socialism etc. (was: Re: Blue Hopper Car Mania...) —Frank Filz
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| | | | <38344C17.6EF@mindspring.com> <38355C1E.55A6BED2@eclipse.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (...) It was not a kid. No I didn't bother to do anything about it. I doubt I would have been successefull. (...) (25 years ago, 19-Nov-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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