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		Re: The constitution has been abrogated
(...) Right. But don't forget that 16 is essentially null and void -- it's a pretense of a new kind of tax when there are only two kinds of taxes: direct and indirect. See: (URL) in mind that I am of the political belief that a tax upon wages is a (...) (22 years ago, 9-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.391)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) Indeed, but it is important to iron out any imperfections. You constitution allows political power to be bought and sold. Millionaires can buy elections. Third parties can run negative campaigns against candidates (eg NRA). Your embassies are (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) It may not be freedom in your mind, John, but it is in mine. Freedom to run for office whether you have friends with millions in the bank or not. (...) Explain to me how no new people would run for office if the most they'd spend would be (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) This claim got me interested. I decided that a thorough analysis of the past fifty years of US politics was beyond my level of interest. So I narrowed my exploration to the current US Senate. I sifted and sorted some stats and came up with: 50 (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) would (...) I didn't say more wouldn't run. It's just that they wouldn't win. (...) Displacing an incumbent is statistically difficult. They already have the advantage in a reelection attempt. Limiting $$$ hurts the challengers. And BTW, (...) (22 years ago, 5-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) The past two UK general elections have produced MPs who got to power with virtually no funding. That is freedom. In the UK we limit MP’s political advertising budgets to allow open access to power. The average winning candidate spends about (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) Only because I am finishing my breakfast and only because it is the day it is... I do have a problem with patriotism. It is the same problem I have with most "religious" people and their seemingly mad fervor for whatever thing they happen to (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) In many respects the USA is "Great". But so was Goliath. Economically and Militarly the USA is "great". But, increasingly, it has failed to be morally "Great". (...) You are free to conform to the norm. I would have more respect for your scrap (...) (22 years ago, 4-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) Where I was coming from wasn't giving anyone a moral scorecard. Just how they had impacted nations that followed. By noting that they were still vital wasn't trying to give any credence to whatever political atmosphere is currently going on, (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) OK, against my better judgement I'm going to wade in here. Thank you John for providing your very simple method of calculating greatness (with which I do not agree but I think coming up with a formula for such a thing would be like nailing (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) Thank you Simon, for bringing up Liberia. Any nation whose Constitution guarantees the freedoms of its people deserves to be included among the greatest nations on earth. The table is set for that country-- the possibilities for them are (...) (22 years ago, 3-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Re: Legal Education? (was: real conspiracies?)
First, let me just say: Holy Crap! What a lot of complicated questions! Obviously, I have to make the usual I AM NOT A LAWYER warning here. But, really -- I am not a lawyer and you shouldn't consider anything I say any kind of legal advice. These (...) (22 years ago, 1-Jul-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.390)

		Please make a donation via Paypal to the Red Cross!
I am sure that most of us received the following message from Paypal If possible, please make a donation, even the smallest amounts count. There will always be someone in need who could use everthing possible right now. I am just about to donate (...) (23 years ago, 14-Sep-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.loc.au, lugnet.general)

smallest
(score: 0.390)

		Re: Troll Alert
I think it is possible to discuss things and disagree in a civil manner. I do it in real life all the time. I think I have done it here before. I hate to use a pop psychology term here, but all I ask of other participants that they "fight fair." In (...) (22 years ago, 29-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.389)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) I'm confused by it. Before we get into why, I want to state clearly that I oppose the practice of reciting the PoA in schools with every ounce of my being -- but not particularly because of the God thing. Such childhood political (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.389)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) Right -- Jefferson, Madison, Franklin, etc... (...) Yes, fair enough -- but while there continues to be some psycho-xtian movement afoot to show that the framers were bible thumpers -- or that they even cared about such things, I think I can (...) (22 years ago, 28-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.389)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) I have not mentioned any particular religion so far, so for you to is a little puzzling... If the FF weren't religious, why envoke the name of God in the D of I? (...) So why should now be any different? (As any politician will soon find out (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.389)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
(...) Here are a few other gems from (URL) Sen. Kit Bond, R-Missouri, was one of many lawmakers who immediately reacted in anger and shock to the ruling. "Our Founding Fathers must be spinning in their graves. This is the worst kind of political (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.389)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
John: The founding fathers were not religious and they were certainly not christians -- and that's putting it mildly. More anon... (...) I am sure at least some critical members actually were; or if not, they were merely deists[1] -- which is sort (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.389)

		Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
Well, I won't go around telling you what to do -- but I disagreed strongly with most of that on a personal level. The separation of church and state should mean that everyone's religious beliefs are respected and that there is no official state (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)

political
(score: 0.389)

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