 | | "facts" (was Re: An armed society...)
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(...) <snip> I've been thinking about "facts" lately. Specifically statistics, polls, charts/graphs...etc. If pro gun advocates use "facts" to show the need for guns, anti-gun advocates can show just as many "facts" to show the uselessness of guns. (...) (23 years ago, 24-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Definitions (was: An armed society...)
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(...) In a way that's my point, ultimately one has to admit that one knows precisely what a word means and stop playing the semantics game. The semantics game is almost endless if the point is to NEVER reach accord. My point was to show that there (...) (23 years ago, 24-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Definitions (was: An armed society...)
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(...) Hmmmf. Doesn't that definition also depend on the meaning of "citizen"? ROSCO (nit-picking again) (23 years ago, 24-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...(what if?)
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(...) And a Lugnet contributor and featured guest of BricksWest is proof that it IS possible to win against the government after one of these outrageous confiscations... Frank (23 years ago, 24-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) Since this has evolved into a gun control debate, I thought the original message should be returned to. "An armed society is a polite society," is the quote used often by gun advocates to somehow indicate that politeness-by-threat is somehow (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...(what if?)
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(...) This could be the case, but it could also be the case that people think the need for such a right has passed. I would think it would take either a consititutional amendment (no easy thing) or a series of presidents that had a litmus test on (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) [snip] (...) I think discounting the possibility of change is short-sighted. The world changes. Laws change. Governments change. People change. Maybe this hasn't changed in a long time, but the fact there's a significant opposition to it (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) I have posted about the Ashwander Doctrine before -- read it and connect the dots, pretty please. (URL) the record, I am not exactly a card-carrying NRA kinda guy...I barely care what they do. (...) No, taxation is Constitutional because of (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) Actually, you would be missing the "duty" part of my argument in this little debate. But whatever... To fully understand the historical context of this debate, it is my opinion that those on the side of gun-control should read William (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) Then it's odd that the NRA, the most vociferous and organized proponents of so-called gun rights, has never brought a case successfully before the Supreme Court, despite numerous opportunities to try. You are of course correct regarding the (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...(what if?)
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(...) To do otherwise means you have to take on BY CHOICE the life forced upon Frodo and Sam Wise in LOTR -- to risk everything at each new moment striving for freedom. It's so much easier to build a series of temporary autonomous zones, and just (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) Dave, your post is too full of errors to take on as a whole so I picked just this one spot. I think it is also an erroneous statement. I could certainly mount arguments that would show that the second amendment is indeed a protection to keep (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) My point is that it's one thing for an author (not you, but the guy who put up that site) to cite an anecdotal and misrepresentational summary of a ruling, and it's quite another to post a link to an entire argument and highlight certain areas (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) abridged citations, right? I am just not wasting my time picking apart the wording and finding facts and figures to contradict yours -- I know they exist. We aren't going to settle this discussion in any way by arguing over statistics. BTW, (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) Well, in terms of Constitutional interpretation, it *is* the supreme word on the matter, until either congress legislates a higher law or another case before the Supreme Court results in an overturning of Miller. (...) Here's the text: (URL) I (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) Well, the obvious source is by Kellerman and Reay: "Protection or Peril? An Analysis of Firearm Related Deaths in the Home." The New England Journal of Medicine, vol. 314, no. 24, June 1986, pp. 1557-60. Gun apologists cite poor methodology (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) You are noting the difference between the "holding" in a decision, and what is termed "obiter dictum." ob·i·ter dic·tum, pl. ob·i·ter dic·ta. 1. an incidental or passing remark, opinion, etc. 2. Law. an incidental or supplementary opinion by a (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) Can we amend that rule so that the first mention of "Big Brother," "jackbooted thugs," or "brave new world" in any non-literary context is likewise a forfeiture? Dave! (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...(what if?)
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With every gun debate I see/read, it seems to me more people would rather live unarmed. I seems likely to me that, within my lifetime, guns will be outlawed from private citizens. Why do I think this likely? Because I just don't see enough people (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: An armed society...
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(...) But we need guns to prevent crime, right? Oh, wait... According to (URL)Most people took multiple precautions during the last year to protect (...) So it's a good thing we need to protect ourselves from the Guvmint--otherwise we wouldn't have (...) (23 years ago, 23-Jan-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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