Subject:
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Re: Democracy.... Dubya Style
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Fri, 19 Dec 2003 19:51:17 GMT
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Viewed:
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1015 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, John Neal wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, David Koudys wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Larry Pieniazek wrote:
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I’m surprised that you’ve forgotten that, John! Newbies like Don may not
realise it yet though... Hence this public service announcement. :-)
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I haven’t forgotten, Lar! I was in “mock mode” with my comment with no
intention whatsoever in engaging Scott on these topics.
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Whereas I usually concur with you, Larry, it seems as of late that Scott had
developed a debate style in which his points are backed up and cited, as is
hte case with this particular arguement.
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I love the notion here in this group that if one produces a cite, it somehow
validates an idea. Reminds me of the knock on the Bible that you can cite it
to prove anything.
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Cites validate an idea inasmuch as the idea has some substance supporting it.
Whether or not the idea is valid is up to the contrary side to prove. As I hear
in other avenues, “saying something is wrong doesn’t make it wrong.”
I once read a button that said “2 + 2 = 5 (for moderately large values of 2)”
If I knew nothing about mathematics, and my only experience with numbers was
this button, and someone were to ask me what 2 + 2 equals, I could cite that
button--“It equals 5, for moderately large values of 2”
Then we could get into a debate where other people could cite Euclid or other
mathematical ‘geniuses’, and show equations that would unequivocably show that 2
+ 2 does not equal 5, but rather, it equals 4.
However, if someone just responded to the “equals 5” idea with “ride! ride!
ride!”, or other sarcastic comment, how did that further the discussion on any
side? Did the ‘respondee’ validate his sarcasm with *any* rationale or cites?
Did the original poster glean anything from this?
Scott was talking about the hypocricy of Dubya where ‘Freedom and Liberty’ were
concerned--
“In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur wrote:
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So Bush talks about Freedom and Liberty whist funding gross human rights
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abuses in places like Uzbekistan & Israel and you think he is >not
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“dishonest”?
He hands out “lucrative” contracts to his buddies and you think he is not
Wake up, you are dreaming!
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How could one sleep with your incessant SOS rants?
JOHN
”
Yes Scott has this thing about Israel and the US. Does that negate his points
that there’s a little hypocrisy goin’ on right now?
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If the counter arguement to this debate is ‘ride ride ride’, I fail to see
how that refutes Scotts points on this particular issue.
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It’s not a refutation, but a mock! I’m tired of his stupid ideas on
these topics and I will resort to mocking him when he brings them up rather
than bang my head on the wall arguing with him about them. If he wants to
troll them out, fine. I will unleash sarcasm mode.
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You may be tired of his “stupid ideas” but you want the conversation ‘cause
you’re still here. Resort to mocking or call it what you will, you want the
conversation, yet you don’t want to show how his points are wrong. I love
sarcasm, and have appreciated that from you as well as most others in this
group, and it has its place in the discussion. However, with sarcasm must come,
at some point, a point (hopefully with cites) that is intended to refute.
Sarcasm on its own does not refute ideas, nor advance the actual discussion.
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I would agree that
had there been a legitimate refution of the points and Scott went down the
‘stylish’ path that he’s known and loved for in the past, it would be at
that point where I’d have written off his arguement as hopelessly
rhetorical.
At this point in the discussion, the rhetoric is not coming from ‘Camp
Scott’ and, lately, Scott hasn’t played that card.
I wait with anticipation to the continued discussion.
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You will wait in vain.
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Hey, it’s probably better than waiting for the Dundas TTC streetcar.
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Democracy.... Dubya Style
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| (...) FINE!!! I admit it (again)-- the US and Israel aren't perfect!!! I am so tired of the comparisons to perfection! It's stupid to discuss! (...) My presence in this NG hangs by a thread as The Fates saw away. If not for the participation of a (...) (21 years ago, 19-Dec-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Democracy.... Dubya Style
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| (...) I haven't forgotten, Lar! I was in "mock mode" with my comment with no intention whatsoever in engaging Scott on these topics. (...) I love the notion here in this group that if one produces a cite, it somehow validates an idea. Reminds me of (...) (21 years ago, 19-Dec-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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