Subject:
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Re: left-leaning pantywaists in Britain (Re: So are they prisoners of war or what?)
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Mon, 4 Feb 2002 17:55:10 GMT
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Viewed:
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393 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler writes:
> In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Scott Arthur writes:
>
> > > It's my understanding that Walker
> >
> > is alleged to have
>
> Oops. Fair enough.
>
> > > committed by the other detainees. Since Walker is a citizen, for
> > > instance, he is able to commit treason against the US, but the average
> > > Al-Qaida member is not similarly able. Therefore, Walker can be arrested
> > > for treason and therefore tried in the US, while non-US citizens cannot be
> > > so arrested. Further, as a US citizein, Walker's crime is also an offense
> > > separate from that of the other detainees; the detainees engaged in war
> > > against the US, while Walker engaged in treason.
> >
> > Indeed. But there are UK "detainees" in Cuba too. Could these guys not have
> > committed treason against the UK? Could they not go on trial in the UK with
> > real charges against them?
>
> Maybe--has the UK made any effort to extradite those detainees (who have,
> I understand, reported that conditions in the detainment center are
> perfectly adequate)?
It was claimed that they were "happy" - which I thought odd.
> That's a good question, though. What's the UK's
> policy on it?
Concerned, but non-troubling making is how I’d describe it:
Straw to quiz US on UK captives
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk_politics/newsid_1789000/1789090.stm
>
> > One does not need to be an expert on "international wartime legalese" to
> > know that the conditions these *alleged* terrorists are being kept in does
> > not meet the standards one would normally expect.
>
> The conditions of their incarceration in fact greatly exceed what I "would
> normally expect" to be maintained for American prisoners held by foreign
> powers, so what "one would normally expect" seems mostly irrelevant to me.
That is irrelevant (even if true). But I do wonder how the next US POW's
will be treated.
> In fact, the conditions in which they are being held are superior to the
> conditions in which I lived during my first two years of college! What's so
> awful about their conditions, exactly?
The fact that they are nothing more than a media curiosity. The sensory
deprivation they suffered is not what I expect from the US justice system.
Nor is being held without charge/trial/legal advise. Where they are being
held does not meet minimum US standards:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1780000/1780545.stm
>
> > From AI:
>
> Out of curiosity, are there any examples of AI getting similarly
> up-in-arms about the treatment of US citizens in unlawful foreign
> detainment? I ask this in sincere good faith.
I’m pretty sure they would. But I doubt they would have to. The guys in Cuba
have largely been disowned and are being associated with the events on
09.11.01. They are not getting much sympathy from anyone right now – that is
how Rumsfeld can crow over the situation. It is left up to people who
believe in freedom and justice to highlight their case – and protect them
from those only interested in revenge.
I expect that if the tables were turned, AI would have no real need to
publicise the predicament of your countrymen– but I expect they would.
What do you think?
>
> > Denying prisoners their internationally recognised rights -- including the
> > right to a fair trial -- can constitute a war crime under the Geneva
> > Conventions and other international humanitarian law.
>
> Also in good faith: does international law set a timeframe for such a trial?
I'm not sure to be honest, but I expect it allows access to legal advise.
Scott A
>
> Dave!
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