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| (...) Bruce has already mentioned the problem of certainty, which is a pretty strong objection IMO. The current system has numerous examples of convicted people who didn’t commit the murders of which they’re accused, so we’re actually executing (or (...) (20 years ago, 4-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) If you can prove that all confessions are 100% truthful. What if he's lying to protect his sister? Sure he probably deserves a penalty for lying about it, but the needle? ROSCO (20 years ago, 4-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) Thanks. Resume kicking position:-) (...) Well, humans only live so long. I see little difference in a sentence of 40 years and one of 3 consecutive life sentences. I love it when someone becomes eligible for parole after a couple of hundred (...) (20 years ago, 4-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler wrote: <snip> (...) Surely you'd agree that the victims differ from the two cases of loss of life-- one "victim" is a murderer, and the other is an innocent. Therein lies all the difference in my view. (...) (...) (20 years ago, 4-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) First, a quote: "You won't have Dick Nixon to kick around anymore." -Dick Nixon (to the press, after losing the governor's race in California, who, sure enough, didn't have the wisdom to stick with his promise and got the ultimate kicking (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) That's an interesting argument. For me, the problem arises when we try to grant one person the authority to kill another. A state-sanctioned execution, once the prisoner has already been rendered harmless, seems to me no different morally from (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
| | | | | Re: I love LUGNET
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| (...) I knew it was so obvious. As I said, I just couldn't resist. (...) Of course I'm referring to principles! I know that. Even if English is my second language, I know the difference between those 2 words. However, I was "paraphrasing" Jason with (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.off-topic.fun)
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| (...) Who told you that!?? Was it one of my jerk employees?[1] (...) I agree with your assessments. I think that if certain individuals hadn't valued liberty more than life, our country wouldn't have been formed, and generally speaking, liberty for (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) I'm not sure what "death-without-freedom" means, or why it might be of any value to the soon-to-be-deceased. Or did you mean "inescapable death" versus "life without possibility of parole?" (...) If the option were put forth as life with (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) (that's not actually a fair example, because those prisoners are trying to get from death-without-freedom to life-without-freedom. It's not an exchange of life and freedom.) Obtaining life-without-freedom opens the possibility of it being (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) Be careful--I hear that you can be a real tyrant, so you're in for quite a conflict with yourself. (...) Hmm. At the risk of over-lawyering, I guess I'd need to be sure of the parameters of the question. Which is more precious: one person's (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) We do work them. The vast majority of prisoners in the penal system participate in some sort of work program, be it washing dishes, road side trash detail, or whatnot. But, as with everything in prison, work is a priviledge and there is always (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| (...) You have to consider the cost of judges wages, court time, time waiting for court cases (spent in jail-more than ten years on average if I remember). That could easily add to more than the cost of incarceration. Also, consider that your (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) Either one, however, is obscenely expensive. And getting moreso. Meanwhile, the penal system gains more and more power in voting blocs, etc. And lawmakers make more things felonies that shouldn't be. You know, if a chunk of my taxes weren't (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| (...) Oh, puhleez. It's a WORD, not a lifestyle/defining principle. And that's "uneducated". (...) ...and that's "site". Oh, the irony. (...) The irony is even thicker... -- Tom Stangl *(URL) Visual FAQ home *(URL) Visual FAQ Home (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| (snip) (...) um...shouldn't that be "principles"? Terry, I challenge you to do a show, and tell every one of the children viewing your display "its f---ing cool!" That's using it in everyday language, right? I wonder how many parents will be leaving (...) (20 years ago, 2-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| (...) (I'm breaking my own self-imposed rule about posting here, so I will deal with me later;-) I have a question I'd like to ask you that in my mind relates to this topic, Dave! Which is more precious: life or freedom? JOHN (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) No way, you've got to be kidding me. Now I know how we massage a budget here in our little sewer district to show numbers we want, so I can imagine a criminal institution can show how it costs $1/day to support a convict. Sorry, I don't buy (...) (20 years ago, 3-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| (...) George Carlin - now there's a man that can swear. (20 years ago, 2-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| (...) Hello Mark: Since your post hasn’t yet been answered, I’ll take a stab at it. You’ve already raised some good objections yourself, upon which I’ll elaborate. You ask what would constitute a satisfactory deterrent/punishment for the planned (...) (20 years ago, 2-Mar-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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