 | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Scott Edward Sanburn
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| | | (...) Just to clarify, I was speaking of just citizenry, and everyday life. The military and soldiers is a totally different arena. The military trains you not to feel "bad" about killing people, it is one of your duties, if you are ordered so. (...) (25 years ago, 13-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Mike Stanley
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| | | | | (...) Heh, that's a helluva understatement. Rather than say the military trains soldiers not to feel "bad" about killing the enemy (they're not people), I'd say we were trained to enjoy, even long for doing it. Luckily, a lot of that brainwashing (...) (25 years ago, 13-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Scott Edward Sanburn
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| | | | | (...) I must imagine so. I just wanted to make certain that killing a person is totally different when you are a soldier, and that they have training for that. I have the highest regards for the armed services, I am glad they are there! Murder is (...) (25 years ago, 13-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Jeremy Sproat
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| | | | | | (...) that. (...) legally, (...) I hope you can see just how stupid-sounding what you just said was. Murder is okay when done at the command of a military officer, but not okay when otherwise? Morality doesn't play into this at all; you just obey (...) (25 years ago, 13-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Mike Stanley
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| | | | | | (...) I certainly don't think he meant to say that, although I can see how you might read it into it. Still, killing the enemy in wartime is not murder. Shooting helpless women and children in Vietnamese villages is murder, though, no matter who (...) (25 years ago, 14-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Christopher L. Weeks
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| | | | | | | (...) I disagree, depending on circumstances. (And so do you, sort of.) Shooting helpless whomever is immoral if they're no threat. What if letting them live will allow them to further contribute to the infrastructure of war against your side? Kill (...) (25 years ago, 14-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Jeremy Sproat
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| | | | | | | (...) They would justify it to themselves. From their point of view, you're part of the problem. Of course, you're perfectly justified -- from your end -- in defending yourself in any way you can. (...) You do have the right to withdraw at any time (...) (25 years ago, 14-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Chris Moseley
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| | | | | | Mike Stanley <cjc@NOSPAMnewsguy.com> wrote (...) Mike, while I don't want to get into a debate with you about military service in general, the issue of "who is the enemy" is a very fuzzy one, and at various times all sorts of people have been (...) (25 years ago, 14-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Mike Stanley
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| | | | | | (...) Yup. And sometimes it's crystal clear. (...) Guess that depends on your perspective. They'd say yes, I'd say no, you'd probably agree with me. (...) In most cases, yes. And in most cases, obeying is almost a reflex. But there have been some (...) (25 years ago, 14-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Naji Norder
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| | | | | (...) crime (...) close. (...) I -did- hear this one on the news.. It was on National Public Radio News the other morning. It likely didn't make your local news, though. It didn't make ours either, but then, if it did, they would have to cut some of (...) (25 years ago, 13-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Mike Stanley
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| | | | | | (...) Yeah, if it isn't football or some part of the local government badmouthing or suing another part, we pretty much don't hear about it. I didn't hear about this either. I don't listen to NPR, though. Can you get the over the net? -- The parts (...) (25 years ago, 13-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Scott Edward Sanburn
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| | | | | (...) Interesting, I have the same feeling about most of what you utter as well. Anyway, lets look into it. (...) That is one of the things that the military expects from you. If you don't like it, don't be in the military. Murder, whether at war, (...) (25 years ago, 15-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | OK, who "lost"(1) this debate? Scott because he officially said the word "Nazi" first, or Sproat, who mentioned "Nurenburg Defense" which, although it does not explicitly contain the word, is clearly related? If it wasn't Sproat (judges, do we have (...) (25 years ago, 15-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —John DiRienzo
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| | | | | Larry Pieniazek wrote in message <37DFA51E.EF0A5623@v...er.net>... (...) That was a cheap trick on Sproat's part. Without actually coming out and saying it, he got Scott to say it. So its cheating, no doubt about it, and Sproat loses (anyway, I (...) (25 years ago, 15-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Jeremy Sproat
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| | | | | <37DF8CDA.DA847F05@aeieng.com> <37DFA51E.EF0A5623@voyager.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (...) I agree. I'll bite. :-, (...) Well, sure, I mentioned the Nuremburg Defense, true, but! It was well (...) (25 years ago, 15-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Scott Edward Sanburn
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| | | | | Sproaticus wrote: <snipped how Jeremy is so pleased with himself> Whatever. I thought about responding to this inane reply, but why bother? I certainly think you dodged around enough of my points, and threw in irrelevant items that had nothing to do (...) (25 years ago, 16-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | (...) Just trying to inject a little levity, Scott, which Sproat riffed on. I wouldn't interpret that post as anything other than as a response to me, so if you want to be annoyed, be annoyed at me. As to the more substantive issues, hey I like to (...) (25 years ago, 16-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Voluntary, private discrimination (Was: Disparicies in Sentencing) —Scott Edward Sanburn
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| | | | | (...) Larry, I don't think you could ever really annoy me, I have been saying go Larry to much on your responses, even with the pink elephants. :) (...) Oh, it does go around. I get frustrated with unnecessary tangents, ones in which Jeremy seems to (...) (25 years ago, 16-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | t7po autopick —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | <37E1178D.C32F22F5@aeieng.com> <37E11F18.DD7E06BF@voyager.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (...) c /unaswered/unanswered/ do NOT c/unaswered/unassward/ although my t7po does phonetically sounds like (...) (25 years ago, 16-Sep-99, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, lugnet.off-topic.fun)
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| | | | | | (canceled) —Jeremy Sproat
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