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Indeed. Although I haven't read the founders as such, I can read the Declaration of Independence and find that the alleged invocation is of the form of "...the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle (...) (22 years ago, 28-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) Amen, brother!!!! You are preaching to the choir on that one! (22 years ago, 28-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) Right -- Jefferson, Madison, Franklin, etc... (...) Yes, fair enough -- but while there continues to be some psycho-xtian movement afoot to show that the framers were bible thumpers -- or that they even cared about such things, I think I can (...) (22 years ago, 28-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) Um, you're overgeneralizing. SOME of the Founding Fathers were indeed professed and practicing christians... Just not any of the ones that did the heavy lifting to get this nation off the ground. So you need to be more specific, I think, (...) (22 years ago, 28-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) It's pretty obvious what brands of religion are going to be the most concerned about this issue. And I don't feel like looking up all your past posts merely to discover that you ARE indeed some kind of christian, it is my assumption that you (...) (22 years ago, 28-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) You seem to be arguing that there shouldn't be a separation between church and state, the same thing these 'founding father' seemed wary of. (...) Deists come *awfully* darn close, in function if not appearance. (...) I've always called the (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) Evidentily the Knights of Columbus did. This Catholic organization is the one that led the charge to get the words "under God" appended to the Pledge of Allegiance. The Pledge has existed longer without those words than with them (okay, not by (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) He's figured us out. Ah well, it was fun while it lasted. DaveE (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) LOL Hope you enjoyed it while it lasted. Seems the old coot who wrote the decision has already recanted. What a quack. -John (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) Here's another encouraging bit of religious tolerance: Newdow said that since the ruling he has received death threats, including one left on his answering machine that said, "You're a dead man walking." Newdow said he has received a flood of (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) I understand that they have been overturned by the SC 12 of 17 times, or something like that. Nice track record! I assume it will be sent up to the (...) Especially after their (US Supreme Court) *last* ridiculous ruling (executing the (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) Since I'm the one who mentioned your libelous comments, I'll address this. You mischaracterize me (and thereby attempt a straw-man argument) by suggesting that I cry libel whenever I read something I dislike--that's simply not the case. I (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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Some more quotes for you: "The government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded upon the Christian Religion." - John Adams "I am no Christian" - Ethan Allen "I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish Church, by the (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) I have not mentioned any particular religion so far, so for you to is a little puzzling... If the FF weren't religious, why envoke the name of God in the D of I? (...) So why should *now* be any different? (As any politician will soon find out (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Serves me right?
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(...) Agreed! You should give grace us with your crap more often. Chris (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Changing the subject... :-)
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Well, um... thanks for clearing that up! (...) Apropos of nothing in particular I would like to point out that as a child I had to sing both lyrical versions of this song at various points in my elementary school career (1), and therefore I remember (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) That line of mine is from 'Oh Canada' Sometimes when I'm debating, I jump from one side of hte border to the other 'cause invariably, the stupidity that happens to our bigger brother, will eventually happen to us, though always on a much (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) I'm confused by it. Before we get into why, I want to state clearly that I oppose the practice of reciting the PoA in schools with every ounce of my being -- but not particularly because of the God thing. Such childhood political (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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John: The founding fathers were not religious and they were certainly not christians -- and that's putting it mildly. More anon... (...) I am sure at least some critical members actually were; or if not, they were merely deists[1] -- which is sort (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: One nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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(...) The original intent of lugnet.lego.direct was to serve for polite, swift and to the point discussions with LEGO Direct (or something mostly to that effect). I think that the group has evolved into something completely different by now. It is (...) (22 years ago, 27-Jun-02, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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