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(...) I apologize for the "doesn't allow using a real programming language" statement. It was clearly false and I realized it immediately after I posted. I didn't want to issue an immediate correction because I hoped that people would ignore it as (...) (20 years ago, 16-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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On Wed, March 16, 2005 11:01 am, John Hansen said: (...) My only reason for commenting was that this has been used as an argument before. You've done a nice job of conveying the fact that you're willing to consider that other languages may be (...) (20 years ago, 16-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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(...) I would agree, but it was you who said "Programming with Robolab is much like creating a flow-chart" and "if you really want to know where spaghetti code comes from, we should talk to those who think flow-charting is a waste of time" here: (...) (20 years ago, 16-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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(...) What you teach by not having a <= operator is that you should write: if ( x < 33 ) printf ( "x is 32 or less" ) ; ...rather than if ( x <= 32 ) printf ( "x is 32 or less" ) ; You can "get away with it" in a language that only supports integers (...) (20 years ago, 17-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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On Wed, March 16, 2005 6:34 pm, John Hansen said: (...) ... (...) wow. I guess I don't have a reply to that. My wife (not a programmer) has used Robolab. She said it was like making a flowchart. I assume you're suggesting Robolab has no flow of (...) (20 years ago, 17-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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John, You make some good points regarding Robolab but I'll confess at the outset here that I'm a big fan of Robolab. After having used Robolab with my FLL teams the past two years I can say that it is a powerful tool that works well for teaching (...) (20 years ago, 17-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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(...) snip.... There must be some serious reasons, why ROBOLAB has won so many international didactical software prizes. One often repeated reason is the fact that ROBOLAB includes absolute fascinating datalogging facilities. This makes of the RCX a (...) (20 years ago, 17-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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(...) The text where I said why Robolab requires people with previously acquired flowcharting skills to unlearn some of their skills and break standard flowcharting rules was deleted. Flowcharting rules require that there be only one type of icon (...) (20 years ago, 17-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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Hi Steve, (...) all the programs you have are well-structured, not spaghetti-code as one would expect for flowcharts at least some of the time. I.e. loops and conditions are properly nested, there are no jumps to some completely different place. Is (...) (20 years ago, 18-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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(...) None of the 4th and 5th grade students I have had an opportunity to know would find NQC to be too much for them. I'm curious how you came to the conclusion that it would be "too much" for the kids on your team to understand or use. (...) Could (...) (20 years ago, 18-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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(...) I do not believe Robolab enforces any structure aside from a sequence of connected icons. It is up to the programmer to position things nicely in order to show structure. Robolab does have tools to align icons and wires. The programs on (...) (20 years ago, 18-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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Hi John, (...) I find these extremely misleading, in a flowchart you should rather use the lines to express control flow. (...) It looks like you will have the same label (land icon color) twice in this case, as subVI a is just a macro. However, a (...) (20 years ago, 19-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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Can someone create a lugnet robotics language advocation group or something? I understand some of you want to debate this, but many are bored of hearing it. I am a programmer with a lot of skill and experience, in fact outside of my robotics, it is (...) (20 years ago, 19-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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This thread is getting a bit long so in the interest of brevity I'm combining my replies to several posts in this one message. (...) Thanks for the kind words, Juergen. This structure is not imposed by Robolab but I'm a programmer by trade so I try (...) (20 years ago, 19-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics, FTX)
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| | Re: Robolab as a tool for teaching programming
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(...) Note that the LEGO Company appears to agree strongly with you. From a press release I just read: ---...--- NEWS RELEASE – March 28, 2005 – NI today announced The LEGO Company uses the NI LabVIEW graphical development environment and NI (...) (20 years ago, 29-Mar-05, to lugnet.robotics)
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