 | | Re: Questions about the nature of property rights (was Re: ("life affirming" == "no initiation of force") == "all rigihts are property rights"?)
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I'd like to introduce some terminology. The rights [1] in my earlier message I'd like to call "basic property rights" [2]. That is: * The right to, through interacting constructively with things in the universe, mark those things as mine. * The (...) (25 years ago, 10-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Questions about the nature of property rights (was Re: ("life affirming" == "no initiation of force") == "all rigihts are property rights"?)
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I realized that last night I failed to address an important question I'd raised earlier: (...) The ideas I've expressed <URL:(URL) apply only to the physical universe -- that is, matter (and potentially energy, because of that equivalence thing). (...) (25 years ago, 10-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Libitarian guff
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(...) One minor point I'd add regarding the occasional need for government: the Securities Exchange Commission was established to prevent the same cataclysmic market crash from happening again. Among other things, the SEC requires that brokers be (...) (25 years ago, 10-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Libertarian stuff (Was: Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?])
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(...) Yes, me too. My hunch is we'll get into this in the property-rights discussion -- but not for a while yet. (...) (For the record, it actually turned out to be a terrible disaster.) (25 years ago, 10-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Questions about the nature of property rights (was Re: ("life affirming" == "no initiation of force") == "all rigihts are property rights"?)
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Ok. Here's some thoughts on answers to my own questions. I should start by saying that I'm not here assuming that property is a natural right -- it seems to be constructed. Nonetheless, much of this applies either way. I'd still like Larry and (...) (25 years ago, 10-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Libertarian stuff (Was: Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?])
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(...) What happens when parents (inevitably) decide that they can provide a decent education at home, rather than spending all of that money? If the child has a right to a certain level of education, and the state has to uphold that right (or rather (...) (25 years ago, 10-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Libertarian stuff (Was: Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?])
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(...) And if the parents decide not to send their child to school, what then? Do they spend time in jail? Who decides what constitutes "schooling", and what doesn't? Why do I get the feeling this inevitably leads to the government deciding whether (...) (25 years ago, 10-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Libertarian stuff (Was: Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?])
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(...) Yah. Right. Did I mention I disapproved of slavery, even if it was freely entered into? (...) You base your worldview on the _Simpsons_? Ah, I guess that's not too bad, really. Hmmmm, donuts.. Jasper (25 years ago, 10-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?]
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Larry Pieniazek wrote in message <3877B741.22DBA4E0@v...er.net>... (...) And in fact my assertion, which may not have been perfectly stated is not "every community will have a library", but that if the value of a community library is sufficient, (...) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Libertarian stuff (Was: Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?])
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(...) More questions I'm afraid :) Using this premise, does the child have a right to expect an education from their parents? And if the parents default on that duty - would the child suffer? (As I understand it, one of a Libertarian state's duties (...) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: ("life affirming" == "no initiation of force") == "all rigihts are property rights"?
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(...) Can you at least quick state your answers to the first two questions I asked, so the problem is clear? (If you don't want to argue from a natural rights basis, I need to ask some different questions.) (...) I will be there. But, I'd rather (...) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Libertarian stuff (Was: Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?])
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(...) It's ok; some kindly corporation would doubtless taken them in. (Huh. There was a Simpsons episode recently on just how this might play out. The school had to close, and a corporation took over. Worked out well, if I remember right.) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: ("life affirming" == "no initiation of force") == "all rigihts are property rights"?
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(...) We're not stuck on this planet. You can, with current technology, go to the moon/Mars and live there. It would merely cost immense amounts of money, but that's irrelevant. (...) Given that the notion of 'country' historically really rests on (...) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Swearing?
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(...) Exactly. That's why I used "adults" rather than "18+". (...) Ethical. I'm for the moment entirely uninterested in anything legal that may or may not coincide. (...) I probably agree. (...) Indeed. (...) By, or for? (...) Yes. And I would like (...) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: ("life affirming" == "no initiation of force") == "all rigihts are property rights"?
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(...) Yes. But fraud is a crime against you that takes PROPERTY away. I tried to kill this one once but Matt is right, without the "you have the right to have property" right, this one is slippery and he can keep wiggling all day long. I can claim (...) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Libertarian stuff (Was: Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?])
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(...) 1-2K can't buy an education. That's not enough for books, other educational tools, and rent/maintenance on the school building, let alone pay for teachers as well. Unless you're talking primary education. (...) Bass boats? (...) Oh yeah, that (...) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: Libitarian guff (Was: Re: Art Debate Was: [Re: Swearing?])
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<Fo1y8z.Mr9@lugnet.com> <38781DD3.4545ED6B@voyager.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (...) Wait. Wouldn't that make you status quo guys happy? Our government is a dollar-electable government. Chris (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: ("life affirming" == "no initiation of force") == "all rigihts are property rights"?
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Hi Guys, This is a good read so far. Thanks. (...) I think the deal is that everything we collectively value about our modern social technology (even if some of us complain about governance) is possible strictly because our systems include an (...) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: ("life affirming" == "no initiation of force") == "all rigihts are property rights"?
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(...) <nitpick> reason is ONE of the tools we have </nitpick> I may take a stab at this too, but like you I have no idea when. The coming weeks are going to be busy, with war coming up. James (URL) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | Re: ("life affirming" == "no initiation of force") == "all rigihts are property rights"?
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(...) That's fine, but I am going to try to show that life-affirming REQUIRES property rights because of the nature of man. That is, to not recognise them is to be anti life affirming, or in other words if you want to be human, you have to recognise (...) (25 years ago, 9-Jan-00, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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