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(...) Quick self-correction: Afghanistan. Can't forget Afghanistan! (But again, that territory was not intended to be appended to the USSR, so even that may not count.) best LFB (23 years ago, 29-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) I can't agree--it only makes the "moral call" that way if your personal values are based on individualism instead of the common good. Those values are nurtured in a capitalist system, so it's a self-replicating system, IMHO. (...) No more so (...) (23 years ago, 29-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Because, as wise spin doctors through the ages have said, the purpose of debate (and even .debate!) is *not* to persuade the other party--rather, it's to persuade the spectators, those who do not feel so strongly in X or Y direction and (...) (23 years ago, 29-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Larry let me say that I'm proud of you for standing up for yourself, and believing in your own ideologies. To all the rest, why do you really care about Larry's opinions? Honestly, he's not going to change his mind, so why haven't all of you given (...) (23 years ago, 29-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) I fail to see how calling you on the logical equivalent "It is the US's fault" vs. "It's not the US's fault" can be called nitpicking your exact wording. Rather it's pointing out glaring inconsistency at a basic level. Just admit you slipped (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Maybe you should have said that in the first place instead of Standard Anti US Diatribe # 8294, then. However it's not a statement that I agree with, except inasmuch as it's not possible to determine with certainty (from any real world (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Perfect! That's the main idea. Dan (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Well, you have ignored the basic point I tried to make in favor of complaining about and nitpicking my exact wording. So I conceed that I am not a good writer and I have not always been perfectly clear the first time I have said something (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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One topic I haven't seen mentioned here is that even with all the sanctions, Cuba still relies heavily upon the US for cash influx. Most of it is through Cuban-Americans sending money back to relatives in Cuba. If that process were denied, then the (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) I'm not being bullheaded, I'm just pointing out your inconsistency. If you then take refuge in calling me names, so be it. Square "I never said in a general way that it's America's fault." with "By imposing sanctions, America is not ALLOWING (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) I would revise that statement to say "The existence of US sanctions against Cuba prevents us from determining with certainty whether Cuban Communism would fail or succeed in the absence of those sanctions." Declaring that sanctions in (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Excellent point, Lindsay! Dan (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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Larry, I'm not back-pedaling on any of my statements or trying to water them down. The sanctions have a PROFOUND effect on Cuba's economy. By imposing sanctions, America is not ALLOWING Communism to work in the country. Example: Imagine if Hawaii (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) If you can't define success, you can't define failure either. You asked me how I define failure, I answered. Remove "seems" if it bugs you that much and replace it with <null>. Doesn't change the definition at all. Communism has failed each (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Wait, Sun Yat-Sen wasn't a communist! :) (...) Oops! The Potato Famine is a case of imperial exploitation, not a failure of capitalism. It's also 1840s to about 1852, not 1857. :) (...) The question is what the basis for redistribution must (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Just a small quibble about that--if the Libertarian powers that be had wanted simply to establish a thought-model of a society in which Libertarian ideals had been fully realized it, and if they also meant no implication of "utopian" status (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) But to have a fair comparison, one must compare quality of work as well as employment. I'd bet that the median (not mean, median) worker in Cuba has a much better lot than the median worker in the United States, even if they don't make as much (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Hmm as do most other EU countries. Perhaps well regulated state funded education systems do have benefits? Infant mortality rate is also higher in the US than the EU - Perhaps well regulated state funded health systems also have benefits? EU (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) The US is very slightly higher: (URL) the UK is higher still (99%) :-) Scott A (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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(...) Indeed. I understand that only ~8% of the Cuban GDP is agriculture based. (...) One could say the same about many political ideals. However, the fact is that some of the communist concepts do have a rather simple attractiveness to a lot of (...) (23 years ago, 28-Aug-01, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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