 | | Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | (URL) ran across this from somewhere else) "since Nagorka generally goes to work in the aisles without prior permission from store officials" Except for the above, note how the story doesn't really even mention the fact that this "artist" (scare (...) (21 years ago, 11-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Bruce Schlickbernd
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| | | | (...) I fail to see where she steals anything in the store. She just rearranges the stock into interesting, if ephemral, shapes. Where's she appearing next? I'll even buy something in the store. :-) -->Everyone's an Art Critic<-- (21 years ago, 11-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | (...) Which someone has to clean up. That's a theft of labor (the cleanup) as well as stealing use of the materials (the pieces are not available for sale while she's "using" them) as well as hinderance of trade (while she's "sculpting", it's harder (...) (21 years ago, 11-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Bruce Schlickbernd
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| | | | | | (...) This seems to be your opinion more than the management of Home Depot, which seem to view it as a mild annoyance at the worst. (...) You are comparing a prosecutable crime with a non-crime. They are free to toss her from the store if they find (...) (21 years ago, 11-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | (...) Meaning that they're not doing their job... we have an endemic problem in the US with management tending to ignore the actual owners of the company, and this is just one more example, albeit minor. (...) Or prosecute. Which I think you're (...) (21 years ago, 11-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Richard Marchetti
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| | | | | | | (...) It's a little hard to take this too seriously, but I'll try just for a moment of distraction... But first, let's make some things clear: 1. HD has terrible service 2. HD is usually very understaffed 3. HD is actually a dangerous place to shop (...) (21 years ago, 12-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Bruce Schlickbernd
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| | | | | | (...) No, as in meaning that your opinion that there is a problem that needs to be dealt with is not shared (currently) by the various managers involved. (...) Prosecute: no, I'm not conceding that, except as a consequence of the artist not bowing (...) (21 years ago, 12-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | (...) OK. Fair enough. And as a most minor among minor shareholders my opinion doesn't count for much. (to management, speaking as a shareholder). However (since this tiny thing is veering off in many different directions) would you agree or (...) (21 years ago, 12-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Tim David
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| | | | | | | (...) how about companies that are run for the benefit of the stock/shareholders to the detriment of service to the customer? This is endemic in companies that supply services to the public sector, especially where the service was previously (...) (21 years ago, 12-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | | | (...) How about them? In a free market, they won't be in business very long, will they? (...) Perhaps you can elaborate a bit on what exactly you're getting at. (21 years ago, 12-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Tim David
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| | | | | | | | (...) Sorry, I'm not really being relevant. Just a bit p****d off with the government privatising and contracting out stuff. I can't see how it can cost less or be better as at the end of the day some of the money has to go to shareholders. In the (...) (21 years ago, 12-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | | | (...) In general, or at specific naff implementations? (...) I'm not sure quite how far back to go to answer this. Do you deny that it's even possible for a private firm to do something more efficiently than a government? If you do, we have no basis (...) (21 years ago, 13-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Bruce Schlickbernd
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| | | | | | | (...) I absolutely agree that major corporations more often than not are run for the benefit of management and not the stockholders. They do it in a variety of ways, too. Only recently have the stockholders started to question the huge salaries and (...) (21 years ago, 12-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Dave Schuler
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| | | | | | (...) Let me see if I understand this. If I go into a store and put a LEGO set in my cart, walk around for an hour or so, and then return that LEGO set to a shelf very near where I'd first picked it up, then I've committed a crime? (...) That's a (...) (21 years ago, 13-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | (...) I don't think so. Hmm. You've come up with a good counterexample, at least on the surface. The easy counter is to discuss intent, your intent presumably was to buy the items til you changed your mind, while she (being an HD hater with a (...) (21 years ago, 13-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Dave Schuler
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| | | | | | (...) I can't comment on Mr. Schlkbrnd's patronage, but I think you've otherwise made your strongest point. If she's making a profit at HD's expense, then HD is within its rights to try to recoup its share of that profit (and that's in addition to (...) (21 years ago, 13-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | (...) I am pressed for time, lots of LEGOWORLD prep I gotta do, so... briefly... (if such is possible) The original post I made sort of took as a given (because it was stunningly obvious to me, anyway) that what she's doing is morally wrong, and was (...) (21 years ago, 13-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Dave Schuler
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| | | | | | | (...) Take your time with a response, if any. LEGOWORLD understandably takes precedence over OT ruminations... (...) The bogging appears to focus on *how wrong* her act was/is, rather than on whether or not it is wrong in some absolute sense. To (...) (21 years ago, 13-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Bruce Schlickbernd
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| | | | | | (...) It seemed stunningly obvious to me that in large part you decided that the artist and NPR were indulging in some sort of anti-corporate crusade in regards to this particular case, evidence that I simply did not see. You've repeated the charge (...) (21 years ago, 13-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | (...) From (URL) (one of the links given in the article): " Ms. Nagorka's use of Home Depot as off-site site underscores an element of social critique present in the work: which is more suitable as a matrix within which to make works of art, the (...) (21 years ago, 14-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | | For some other perspectives on this: (URL) Clean up Sculpture on Aisle 9!> (these include people who purport to work for HD, and people who purport to be the gallery owner I cited in my last post, and a bunch of other voices) This has been an (...) (21 years ago, 14-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Dave Schuler
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| | | | | | (...) I don't care enough to research the full breadth of Ms. Nagorka's work (which I likewise find disappointingly pedestrian), but the passage you cite strikes me as a critique by Debs & Co. rather than a formal declaration of intent by the (...) (21 years ago, 14-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Larry Pieniazek
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| | | | | | (...) Apparently so, Dave! (...) Sure, Dave! ALL you have to do is let me get the last word, Dave! That's really not so hard, you know, Dave! (speaking of debates (internal in this case), I'm torn between taking the bullet train or taking more (...) (21 years ago, 14-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Dave Schuler
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| | | | | | (...) Well, your clothing won't get you there as fast, but if you wear the bullet train, you'll probably be overdressed. Dave! (21 years ago, 14-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Adrian Egli
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| | | | (...) I've got a "What if?" She's stacking up these bricks without the store's OK to show off her artistic talents. One slips out of her hands as she's stacking and it is the last and highest placed. The brick then lands on her foot and breaks (...) (21 years ago, 11-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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| | | | | | Re: Art? or Theft? or just signs that NPR is damaged. —Bruce Schlickbernd
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| | | | (...) She's responsible for her own actions. But that's just my view - see below. (...) If she delibrately broke her own foot, that would actually be fraud, not theft. If an accident, and a jury found the store in part responsible because it did not (...) (21 years ago, 11-Oct-03, to lugnet.off-topic.debate)
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