Subject:
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Re: Fool's Question
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.market.theory
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Date:
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Wed, 16 Jun 1999 16:21:09 GMT
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Viewed:
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444 times
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Mike Stanley wrote:
>
> Janet Zorn <lighthouse@bonzai.net> wrote:
> > Flame if you want. But an helpful answer might convert me to your
> > opinion.
> >
> > Why do sellers on Ebay care if there is sniping?
> >
> >
> > I understand why bidders hate it. I understand that the Ebay rules are
> > not the best ones.
> >
> > But if you are going to sell an item on Ebay knowing what the rules
> > are, why do you want to discourage sniping?
>
> Well, I didn't bother to do the math in Chris's post, so I can only
> assume that it discourages sniping. Can't really comment on it,
> though.
>
> As a seller, why would I not like sniping?
>
> Hrmmm, probably lots of little reasons, some of which may not have
> much to do with maximizing my profit.
>
> I'd rather see someone who had successfully defended his high bid a
> few times get the item than some loser who dropped in at the last
> second. Personally. At that point, money-wise, the difference is
> insignificant, since the sniper only has to pay a tiny bit more.
>
> If eBay made the auctions automatically extend themselves by a day, or
> 4 hours, or 12 hours, I might end up making more money. The snipee,
> given a chance, may redefend the bid.
>
> Dunno, I guess I just don't like people who look, to me, like
> cheaters, winning the game.
Some thoughts from a current buyer, probable future seller
I've been sniped a couple times. In most of these cases I would have
gone above the bid the sniper placed. One thing I have started to do is
near the end of the auction (or near the last time I will be able to pay
attention to the auction), I will bump my maximum bid up to something
that's actually a little above what I really am willing to pay. This has
not yet backfired on me. A couple times my final price has gone up, but
I still won the item, a couple times I was overbid, and was satisfied
that I would not have gone for the item at the final price. This is of
course what eBay wants you to do, and I guess from one perspective that
will give the best price, since people following this mechanism will
actually overbid for the item.
One item I had put a bid on at the minimum price to "reserve" the item
in case I didn't win an earlier auction for a similar item. After
winning the first auction, and the 2nd one nearing its end, and NO ONE
else bid on the item, I decided to up my bid to what I paid for the 1st
item. Shortly before the end of the auction, a sniping attempt occured,
and my bid was raised. I didn't absolutely want the item, but hey, why
should someone else get a deal (now why the people who were bidding
against me in the 1st auction didn't go for the 2nd I don't know). This
is a real interesting case. In a traditional G1, G2, SOLD auction, I
either would have gotten the item for the minimum bid, or the G1, G2,
SOLD process would have elicited some more bidding activity and brought
the item up to a more fair price.
I have also probably sniped a couple times, though most times when I
have jumped in at the last minute with a bid, it has been on an auction
I had bid early on. I think the first auction I won, I actually sniped
without realizing that I had bid on an item which was about to close (I
don't always translate PDT to EDT correctly...).
As a potential seller, I agree with Mike's point about wanting the sale
to go to someone who showed an interest in the item by bidding early. I
see the snipers partly as folk dropping in at the last moments of an
auction which is closing at a lower than normal price, and seeing if
they can get a quick deal, though their interest may be minimal (but
hey, if they can get the item at a bargain price, why not, afterall,
perhaps they can just wait a week or two, and turn the item around for a
normal bid).
My biggest problem overall with sniping is that it leaves people upset.
In the long run, I believe this will reduce prices as some people will
drop out of the auction scene. In the short term it may increase prices
as pissed off people put a huge bid the next time a similar item comes
up. Of course sometimes the pissed off person may try to intimidate
other bidders (this happened to me on Serious Collector once - I refused
to be intimidated, and made a fair bid, I also resisted the urge to make
a bid I was unwilling to pay to force the pissed off person up to the
bid he told me he was willing to pay, I probably would have ended up
overpaying for the item, which in fact went to a 3rd party for less than
amount the person told me they were willing to pay). If people get too
frustrated with an auction venue, they will either drop out of auctions,
or look for a different venue. Either situation results in fewer bidders
in the venue being used.
Unfortuanately, from eBay's recent snafu this past weekend, you can't
even claim advantage to the one thing which is a supposed advantage of a
fixed end time. Several auctions were extended 4 days. This is long
enough to cause everyone involved enough problem that a transaction
might take an extra several weeks if one or the other party was going on
a vacation. If a few days isn't going to cause a seller difficulties,
they're better off with some kind of G1, G2, SOLD progression which can
extend the auction a little bit (setting a 6 hour interval for example
would probably at most extend an auction a few days, and give most
people a chance to respond).
With that said, here's an idea for fixed end auctions which would be a
bit more fair:
Up til the last day, bid increments are very modest.
On the last day, bid increment jumps to 5-10%, in the last few hours,
jumps to at least 10%.
If you really are interested in that $100ish item, but aren't willing to
pay $110, bid before the last day. If someone wants it for $110 or even
higher, fine. They'll get it. If it was the person who was the high
bidder up til the last day, they'll have a chance to defend their bid.
If you're max is less than 10% below your real max, perhaps you should
bid a little higher.
This scheme of course still doesn't eliminate the problem. A bidder
might still be willing to participate in a bidding frenzy after it
starts.
All in all, I will certainly continue to bid on eBay. I will limit my
sniping, and then primarily to fighting defensively for the items I'm
interested in, or times when I notice something interesting at the last
minute. I will probably use eBay to sell some items, and other venues to
sell others.
--
Frank Filz
-----------------------------
Work: mailto:ffilz@us.ibm.com
Home: mailto:ffilz@mindspring.com
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Message is in Reply To:
 | | Re: Fool's Question
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| (...) Well, I didn't bother to do the math in Chris's post, so I can only assume that it discourages sniping. Can't really comment on it, though. As a seller, why would I not like sniping? Hrmmm, probably lots of little reasons, some of which may (...) (25 years ago, 16-Jun-99, to lugnet.market.theory)
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