Subject:
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Re: Disclaimer
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.inst, lugnet.general
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Date:
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Fri, 9 Jan 2004 17:43:24 GMT
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Reply-To:
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cjmasi@*nogarbageplease*rcnAVOIDSPAM.com
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Viewed:
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7554 times
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Steven lane wrote:
> I will soon be adding some instructions to the Brick Instruction Portal that I
> will be offering for sale. It occurred to me that I'd need a suitable
> disclaimer. I checked on Bip and found their wasn't one so I thought if I post
> on Lugnet I can get a consensus of idea's. I've already contacted Jake from Bip
> and he say's he'll add it to the resource section for everyone's use so you
> wouldn't just be helping me, it's now a community project. • >
> Here are my current idea's
>
> The disclaimer should indemnify the author of instructions from claims in
> response to
>
> 1. The builder buying bricks he doesn't need due to errors in the instructions
> (although the author has a duty of care to keep errors to a minimum).
If you are selling instructions you should make _certain_ that they are
correct. If you are giving instructions away for fun, then do you really
need this kind of protection?
> 2. Injuries caused to the builder while playing with/using the design.
Wow, what a great, litigious world that we live in, huh?
> also the disclaimer would need to state that the author retains all rights to
> the work and remains the owner.
Stamp it with a copyright notice and file it with the Library of
Congress (don't forget to include your $30).
> The work is sold "as is" and is not guaranteed free from defects.
See comment from 1.
> The buyer cannot copy or re-distribute the work via any media be it paper or
> electronic.
Sure, it is your work, you hold the copyright.
> The buyer is basically licensing the design.
>
> The buyer cannot lend his instructions to anyone.
Completely and totally disagree with this stipulation. If I am not using
something I don't see why I cannot share it with my friend. However, I
do understand that people shouldn't "share" copies electronically
because this usually turns into making an electronic copy for your friend.
> The buyer cannot let anyone else use the instructions unless they are helping to
> build the model for the instruction owner either wholly or in part.
See above comment.
> The disclaimer should state that sub-assemblies cannot be copied and used in
> another set of instructions without the authors written permission (E-mail
> would also be acceptable).
Assuming you mean actual copies of the instructions, then no, people
shouldn't be allowed to copy part of your instructions into their
instructions. If you mean the design itself, you are going to have a
very hard time here and I could easily find situations where I would
disagree with the stipulation. For example, the common two-wheelset
bogie (truck) commonly used by LEGO train builders appears in
instructions already. Does that mean no one else can include that common
sub-assembly in their models or instructions? So, to what sub assemblies
would this apply? I am sure I'll be corrected if I am wrong, but to
protect a design element you need a patent, don't you?
> The disclaimer should also disallow the building of copies for other people
> unless their to be given as presents. I thought we could implement this by
> saying you cannot build copies for financial reward. This could also be covered
> my making people use only bricks that they actually own and not somebody else's.
Hmm. This is a tough one. Why not? Why can't I build models from your
instructions for a fee? But then again, why should someone else be
allowed to reap financial reward from your work.
> The disclaimer could be modified by each author to suit their needs.
>
>
> These are just my current idea's and all are open to change/removeal.
>
> So all I need now is feedback and the actual form of words that will be used.
>
> Thanks
>
> Steve
The areas where you address intellectual property issues make me feel a
bit squirmy. I believe in intellectual property, and I believe that
copyrights should be protected. After all, it is your work. If you wish
to license your model with restrictive clauses fine. I don't think that
a public "free" forum should have restrictive licensing policies. The
only kind of licensing policy that a free forum should have is one that
precludes the use of the free material in commercial enterprises (or
some variant with that spirit). Here is a summary of my feelings
concerning the IP of fan created intructions.
The instructions are yours. You created them. You hold the copyright.
Therefore, copyright law applies, and at the simplest level that means
that no one can make copies of the actual instructions without your
permission. I don't know how copyright applies to the constuction of
multiple models from a set of instructions. I assume (probably wrongly
so) that copyright does not apply, directly, to the act of building
multiple models, and that limitation has to be arrived at by some kind
of licensing scheme that uses copyright law as the leverage to require
the comsumer to accept the license.
How you choose to use your rights under copyright law is up to you.
Personally, I think a "no commercial use" license is totally reasonable,
but a "no loaning to your friend" license is asinine and only encourages
people to abuse intellectual property laws.
Consider software licenses too, I haven't looked carefully at all of the
license agreements for LDRAWing tools and the like, but you should check
them. Some programs like POV-Ray allow for the commercial use of their
software, the user is explicity allowed to create scenes and sell those
images. However, other programs might have other agreements. Take Track
Designer for example. From the Track Designer web page
"Terms and Conditions
Track Designer Version 2.0 is provided free of charge for personal use
only. You have royalty-free rights to redistribute original designs that
you create with Track Designer. If you publish layouts on the Internet,
please include a link to this website...
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/train_depot
Track Designer Version 2.0 is not 'Shareware', you have no right to
redistribute it in any form whatsoever, including, but not limited to,
distribution on diskette, CDROM, Usenet Newsgroups, Internet Websites or
bulletin boards, without the express written permission of the author.
Copyright of the individual bitmaps remains the property of Matthew
Bates. The bitmaps may not be used for commercial or any for-profit
purposes."
I interpret this to mean that if you were to use track designer, you
could not use the bitmaps supplied with track designer to generate
layouts and then sell those layouts. You would have to create your own
track bitmaps and use those bitmaps for any commercial product.
The biggest of the big legal issues. The legal area of ldraw.org
(http://www.ldraw.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=227)
clearly states
"Official Model Repository Disclaimer
The LDraw.org 'Official Model Repository' is a compilation of
unofficial, fan-created data files. The patterns of LEGO elements
depicted in these files represent intellectual property owned by the
LEGO Group of companies, which does not sponsor, authorize, or endorse
this compilation."
Thus, all instructions made using LDRAW tools are based on the LEGO
Company's IP. It is true that the dat files were reverse engineered
(people measured the bricks, people didn't steal the dimensions from a
filing cabinet), but I don't know that this kind of reverse engineering
is allowed. Clearly it wouldn't be if one were to use these files to
make molds of patented LEGO bricks, but that isn't what we are talking
about here. So, are our instructions allowed to exist simply by the
grace of the LEGO Company[1], or do we actually have a legal right to
create virtual representions of the LEGO Company's IP?
Anyway, I have written far more than I intended to write.
I wish everyone who wants to sell instructions luck. You should feel
free to protect your IP as you see fit. I have stated my opinion on what
I think it reasonable, but it is only an opinion. As far as my LEGO
models go, all I ever ask it that credit is given where credit is due.
If someone reproduces one of my pictures, then that someone should let
people know who took the picture. If you make a model that looks like
mine, make my day and send me an email of the picture or a link to the
picture. But if you build a model by looking at a picture or by going
through a dat, you don't need to site me publically, afterall, YOU built
the new model :), but if you want to site me it will make me smile.
By the way, I am not a lawyer (can you tell :). I am a professor of
chemistry.
Chris
1. when you think about it, the LEGO Company is fairly generous with
their IP. Are there many other companies that allow fans to distribute
copies of older, but still copyrighted, artwork? LEGO could have very
easily required Brickshelf to eliminate _all_ instructions, but the LEGO
Company understands that Brickshelf actually _helps_ the LEGO Company.
LEGO could have made life dificult for the creators of the various LDRAW
tools out there.
After re-reading your post, I realized that this isn't acutally the
feedack that you were looking for, but I'll post this anyway because I
like reading myself type (aka hearing myself talk :).
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Message has 2 Replies:
 | | Re: Disclaimer
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| (...) If the instructions are sold containing an error, then I agree that the author isn't accountable for buyers who purchase additional bricks from a separate source, but if the author is also selling the bricks to make the set, then the author is (...) (20 years ago, 9-Jan-04, to lugnet.inst, lugnet.general)
| | | Re: Disclaimer
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| (...) Mistakes will always occur, and the disclaimer is only meant for saleable instructions. (...) Well I didn't invent it, blame the lawyers. (...) I'm british, but I get your drift. (...) The disclaimer is supposed to be broad. If applied to very (...) (20 years ago, 9-Jan-04, to lugnet.inst, lugnet.general)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Disclaimer
|
| I will soon be adding some instructions to the Brick Instruction Portal that I will be offering for sale. It occurred to me that I'd need a suitable disclaimer. I checked on Bip and found their wasn't one so I thought if I post on Lugnet I can get a (...) (20 years ago, 9-Jan-04, to lugnet.inst, lugnet.publish, lugnet.cad, lugnet.general)
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