Subject:
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Re: State of .mecha
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.build.mecha
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Date:
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Fri, 21 May 2004 10:02:19 GMT
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Viewed:
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813 times
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I wanted to comment on this, but have been taking my time - mulling over what to
say about it. Here we go:
In lugnet.build.mecha, Soren Roberts wrote:
> Hey all.
>
> I've been in contact with one of our old posters, one Stuart Immonen by name,
> and he gave me permission to post this message. I have not altered it except to
> clean up line-wrapping and spelling. Any errors should be assumed to be my own.
>
> BEGIN QUOTE
>
> I think you're doing a stellar job in stirring up interest, if not in a new
> crop of builders yet, then in the "old guard". Keep stirring.
Agreed.
>
> I fear that you may be up against enormous forces, but the idea is worth
> encouraging. .space is a great newsgroup, and one worth emulating. The collegial
> atmosphere is engaging and the trading off and sharing of
> (sub)themes is a very very positive thing. I think if .mecha is to survive
> way over there alone under .build, then "themes" might be an idea worth
> pursuing. Unfortunately, as you well know, just the basics of mech building are
> tough, and to dress up an armature in a, say, Jade Empire or Eastern Block
> armour is a bigger challenge than people realize. Maybe this is why people stay
> away from mech building generally.
I'm not certain what forces Stuart is referring to here. Last I checked, this
group is very supportive of one another. Even Eric and I, who have more public
disputes than we should, support the other's efforts in feeping .mecha an
engaging and informative place.
As much as I hate to agree with Stuart regarding 'themes', I must agree. .space
has it easy when it comes to their builds simply because ANY part can be used in
.space and no one looks at you funny. Not so with .mecha. It takes quite a bit
of preperation in order to pull off a preset theme especially when the creation
you are building is to also be an original and engaging design. It can be done,
but it isn't easy.
> Still, it might be fun and encouraging to try a build-off with a "blank
> slate" armature (Gla's is probably the most well-known one, but there are
> others, and smaller ones to
> boot. Mladen's Pixie might be a good base, too), with the goal being to try
> and get as many different looks (possibly using established .space factions)
> based on the same armature.
This has been done before, but I'd be willing to go back to this again. Pixies
have been done in a variety of designs and I'd love to see us pull together a
pixie contest of some sort. Gla's armature would be interesting as well, but
many folks don't/won't have the parts to pull this off. Still, this idea has
merit to it.
> Joint discussion is a constructive (!) idea. But you don't need to jump right
> into original joint ideas or modded building. TLG makes a number of
> good joints now that can be used to great effect. I had an idea recently
> about "grading" joints as to their stiffness, range of motion and size to give
> an overall point structure. On a scale of 1-10 on stiffness, for example, a worm
> gear would be a 10 (immobile) and a frictionless pin would be a 1 (free moving).
> The various click joints would be 7s, 8s or 9s but be widely different on the
> size scale. Snead's modded hinges would be in that range, too. Plate hinges
> would be less than 5.... like that.
Nice idea, but with the sheer variety of how these joints can be used, I'm not
certain the scale idea is workable. For instance, how would you scale a joint
that is gear-based, backed by ball joints (for stiffness). It's almost like
trying to figure out the permutations of 8 2x4 bricks in 8 colors - too many to
realistically count. Scale plays a BIG part in this as well.
>
> Then you can get into combinations of unmodded bricks like Mino's arm:
>
> http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?i=626413
>
> Kerouac's elbow:
>
> http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?i=354348
>
> Or the shoulder joint I stole from someone... (sheepishly):
>
> http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?i=706230
>
> A gallery of great hands and ankles?
>
> A gallery of great colour combinations? Classic? Unusual?
>
> http://www.webdevelopersnotes.com/design/14.php3
Great ideas! Why no one has brought them up before or tried to put something
like this together is beyond me. I know I've never gotten an email about this.
These are all fantastic ideas that take time to pull together and implement.
Anyone who wants to have a go at this, please step forward - I'm certain
neither Eric nor I will turn you down.
>
> And a gripe:
>
> Where I feel .mecha mostly lacks is the way it is "unmoderated". They should be
> seeking out stuff to show off and keep the group alive, not just waiting for
> someone like yourself to point out great builds like Kotaro Ono's.
Hold up a sec here. By 'they', I'm assuming Stuart is referring to both Eric and
(mostly) I. Curating a group isn't a paid position last time I checked. I've
posted numerous threads about cool new builds and even had a lukewarm response
to a thread I started that directly pointed out builds that were overlooked on
Brickshelf that month.
http://news.lugnet.com/build/mecha/?n=9049
I was trying to get a dialog started as we tend to try doing in this group, but
as usual, the lack of significant responses made me push this idea to the back
burner in favor of keeping the sidebar focused on what others were actually
posting about. I don't have a ton of time available to curate, so I use it
sparingly where I think it will do the most good. I'm sorry you don't agree,
Stuart, but if more people stepped up as Soren has done, this group would be in
a MUCH nicer state than it is today (not that I think it's lacking too badly,
mind you).
> For instance,
> Mino gets ignored:
>
> http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=31038
>
> http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=68855
>
> http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?i=627332
>
> http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=48422
>
> Nakany:
>
> http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=75697
>
> There are two great "moe" mecha on LegoRoboPlan right now:
>
> http://www1.linkclub.or.jp/~zizy/ROBO/
>
> (I put the photo on my own server: http://www.immonen.ca/work/moe04.jpg not
> sure who did it-- maybe zizy?)
>
> Even Pazill (Padiru) gets nothing, and he's a member of the LMHoF!
>
> http://pj-planet.cside.com/legoplanet/
Fair enough - why is no one posting about them? Don't place this entirely on the
backs of the curators - that isn't our job around here. I do this when I am
able, and lately that just hasn't been possible. What is keeping them from
posting links? Language issues? The thought that Brickshelf posting is enough? I
don't know the answer to this and I doubt you do either.
Quick aside: Why did you remove your Brickshelf folder, Stuart? Now all those
wonderful creations that are linked in our archives are impossible to get to
using the links in your posts. Worse still, now I have to take the time to go
into the archives and point out that there is 'no picture available' for this
post. Once I archive something, it should stay the way I archive it, but
sometimes people reload their Brickshelf accounts or change thumbnails or
folders around. It takes time to update things like this - time I'd rather spend
posting or building.
> It's up to the mods to show off how cool this stuff is, and they don't
> or aren't able to do it. Perhaps a lot of these creations (and I include Azumu
> Kawasaki's brilliant Pokemon) don't match up with the mods' personal aesthetic,
> and therefore are not worthy of mention.
>
> END QUOTE
First off, we are curators, not mods. Mods have the ability to revise and delete
threads as needed - I have no such ability, nor do I want it. I love all types
of mecha creations and would post about every one if I had nothing else to do
with my life. I'm certain Eric feels the same way. Anyone who wants to post
about brilliant creations such as these is free to do so - I won't stop you.
Heck, I'll probably highlight them in some way.
A curator's job is primarily upkeep of the sidebar, upkeeping any sub-pages, and
also to keep talks ongoing within the group. This was taken directly from the
.curator sidebar:
NOTE: Being a curator doesn’t give you cancel privs, nor does it give you any
authority to tell other posters what to do. It’s just a bully pulpit and the
ability to modify the header. It IS, however, a sign that you have some regard
in the community and used wisely, can be a force for improving conversations.
Sometimes I've used it wisely, sometimes not, but I've always tried to use it
for the betterment of the group. If I didn't want to be the curator of
.build.mecha, I never would have asked for the position and I know Eric feels
that way as well. Look at the majority of the newsgroups with curators assigned
to them and I'm certain you'll see many nice looking newsgroups with little
interaction or conversely tons of interaction, but lacking sidebars. .mecha
tries to meet this halfway and I think we succeed.
As always, I am open to suggestions on how to improve the group and make it more
interactive and exciting, BUT I won't do 100% of the work and get nothing
(feedback-wise) in return for it. I like to hear what people are up to just as
much as anyone else - that's what the email link on the sidebar is there for.
Only once have I not responded to it and that's only because the babelfish
translator didn't do a good enough job translating the Italian for me to form a
coherant response.
Quite honestly, I'd love to devote 24/7/365 to .build.mecha - I know I could
implement some very cool features, but it just isn't possible at this time. Now
once I win the lottery, we'll talk. ;)
Thoughts? I'd love to hear them,
-Dave
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Message is in Reply To:
 | | State of .mecha
|
| Hey all. I've been in contact with one of our old posters, one Stuart Immonen by name, and he gave me permission to post this message. I have not altered it except to clean up line-wrapping and spelling. Any errors should be assumed to be my own. (...) (21 years ago, 14-May-04, to lugnet.build.mecha)
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