Subject:
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Re: Schpiffkraft Hakenkreuz
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 10 Aug 2005 18:24:30 GMT
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Viewed:
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1175 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Samuel Morrison wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Leonard Hoffman wrote:
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Samuel Morrison wrote:
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I have to disagree - horrible though it was, there was more to Nazism than
just hate...
Adn does it really matter WHY millions were killed?
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I’m not arguing that Nazism is only hate - but that is based on hate. And
yes, it does matter, to me. The people who killed thousands fighting the
Nazis do not bear the same responcibility as the those who killed innocents
for no reason except the color of their skin or the religion.
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My bad, I should have said murdered. Soviet murder vs. Nazi murder I don’t se
as much different.
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You don’t see a difference between a coordinated effort to complete destroy a
race of people vs. a criminal justice system gone horribly wrong? Stalin had
almost 30 years to kill roughly 20 million Russians - most of whom were killed
in Gulags for political crimes. Hitler had 13 years (4 of which were the
Holocaust proper) to kill 12 million people - most of whom were killed for being
the wrong race/religion.
You don’t see a difference? Maybe you’re not looking hard enough.
The Soviet system continued past Stalin’s death and while political crimes
continued, they were nothing like under Stalin’s rule. It was the opening of
the Soviet system by the Soviets themselves that lead to glasnos and
perestroika - and the fall of communism in the 1990s.
But let me ask you a different question: Do you see a difference between Nazis
murdering Jews and Americans murdering Indians? How about with British
murdering South Africans and Boers? How about with Belgians murdering Congans?
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I like your EB MOCs, Lenny, and I think that this one may have crossed the
line in polite society, but I think some of the defenders here have a
point. Why does a symbol make a MOC horrible while others embrace the same
spirit in their MOCs?
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You’re reading too much into the criticism. My criticism is very simple:
The MOC is potentially deeply offensive, poorly designed, and unfunny. I
think Richie should have posted on an adult only forum (like JLUG). But I
am not calling for his post to be deleted, I am giving my opinion of what he
should have done. That isn’t censorship, thats my free speech.
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And I disagree - it’s raised a nice discussion, for one thing. This isn’t
obsenity. Offensive to some, sure, but that is what life is all about. And
the MOC isn’t advocating Nazism, either, just dealing with it in a humorous
(though some say failed humor) light.
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What do you disagree about? That I’m advocating censorship? That my critique
misses the point? Yet you agree that the MOC is potentially offensive. Do you
think the MOC is really great, with innovative techniques?
I didn’t say it was obscene. You’re putting words in my mouth again. I didn’t
say it advocated Nazism either.
-Lenny
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Message has 1 Reply:
 | | Re: Schpiffkraft Hakenkreuz
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| (...) So it's not as bad if you stretch out your genocidal activities over a few decades rather than just one? And I'm sure a few ethnicities within the former Soviet Union may disagree that they committed "political" crimes. Like the Kulaks, the (...) (19 years ago, 10-Aug-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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Message is in Reply To:
| | Re: Schpiffkraft Hakenkreuz
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| (...) My bad, I should have said murdered. Soviet murder vs. Nazi murder I don't se as much different. (...) And I disagree - it's raised a nice discussion, for one thing. This isn't obsenity. Offensive to some, sure, but that is what life is all (...) (19 years ago, 9-Aug-05, to lugnet.off-topic.debate, FTX)
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