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Subject: 
Re: New Website Design Test
Newsgroups: 
lugnet.castle.org.cw
Date: 
Mon, 11 Sep 2000 19:59:07 GMT
Viewed: 
600 times
  
In lugnet.castle.org.cw, Anthony Sava writes:
In lugnet.castle.org.cw, Chris Gray writes:
"Frank Filz" <ffilz@mindspring.com> writes: • <snip>
I do have one overall comment, however: I dislike frames in general. They
take away one of the most important resources in a browser window: horizontal
space. I don't run with my browswer window full screen, I like to have
other windows visible around/behind it so that I can do things like cut
and paste URL's, etc. The use of frames then makes the main frame narrower
than the browser window by the width of any other frames (and the scrollbar
the browser puts in since my window is also not full height). A big image,
or a wide table or some pre-formatted text then doesn't fit and I have
to scroll back and forth (with yet another scrollbar taking up valuable
space) to see it all.

Another problem with frames is that it is nearly always the case that when
someone follows a link out of a frame, the page doesn't do the proper
frame resetting, and the new page ends up being shown inside the old frame,
and the navigation frame (or whatever) from the old page is still there!
That can be quite annoying, especially if you get a couple of the left-over
frames stealing a lot of space.

In my own defense, I know perfectly well how to prevent any navigation/frame
errors with links.  I also know how to break out of frames and start new
browser windows.

Just to give another oppinion I also dislike frames quite a bit.  It makes it
difficult if not impossible to like to a page without taking it out of the
frame.  I have no doubt you can write your pages using frames but in general I
encourage people to not use them.

Also please whatever you do don't start opening new browser windows from links
on your site.  That is major annoying and I usually won't even visit a site
that does this.  Frames I can deal with opening new browser windows for no good
reason I can't.


Rather than using frames, my suggestion is to make all of your pages have
a consistent navigation structure. E.g. in your case, put all of the
link boxes and graphics at the top of *every* page. If you can make them
a bit smaller, they won't occupy much room. The big difference here is
that they aren't stealing horizontal space. The other is that, even in
the presence of unclosed frames, they go away when a link is followed
to someone else's page.

I do have my links at the top of every page, however, I have so many pages
that my buttons get very cumbersome to have on each.

Let me ask you this...

Is there a need for all the buttons/links to be on every page?

Sometimes all you need on each page is a link back to your home page and
because that should remain static you shouldn't need to worry about any update
problems.

If you think there is a need for all the link/buttons on every page then maybe
frames are a better choice.  Again I personally don't like them but if you feel
they give you the best effect and keeps the site maintainable maybe they are
the right choice for you.


If I may play devil's advocate, I will have over 15 pages after my next update
to my page.  Frames is a *wonderful* way of being able to update links without
having to go into every  -  single  -  page  -  which believe you me, isn't
fun.  With frames, I'll be able to update one page, and everything will be
done.  I'm still playing with a vertical frame set, but I have not decided how
to do that one yet, I have so many pages, that my buttons, at least in their
present state, might take up a good quarter of the page, if i have them all
viewable at the same time.  Perhaps I will come up with better, smaller
buttons, but for now, their all I have.

In reality it is a preferance thing.  To you Frames are *wonderful* to Frank
and I, I think we both prefer a differant approach.


Good work though,


Eric Kingsley

The New England LEGO Users Group
http://www.nelug.org/

View My Creations at:
http://www.nelug.org/members/kingsley/



Message is in Reply To:
  Re: New Website Design Test
 
(...) if (...) frame, (...) be a (...) In my own defense, I know perfectly well how to prevent any navigation/frame errors with links. I also know how to break out of frames and start new browser windows. (...) I do have my links at the top of every (...) (24 years ago, 11-Sep-00, to lugnet.castle.org.cw)

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