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"Bob Gomez" <kukumba@aol.com> wrote in message news:H83wI4.56M@lugnet.com...
<snip> I guess some will say that the market has changed and kids today
don't have
the attention span that they used to. </snip>
I'm getting a bit tired of hearing this over and over again. Anybody wonder
why kids have such short attention spans? I think it's because everything is
prefab, readymade, spoonfed to them. Here's a few examples:
- Children's TV. When I was young childrens TV was on wednesday afternoons
and saturdays. That's it. Now when my daughter wants to see a cartoon she
can flick on the telly any time of the week and choose from 30 channels. And
then there's the programs themselves. Nothing lasts for more than a few
minutes, and is interrupted for commercials.
- Food. Remember when there wasn't a big M on every corner, and you couldn't
have sweets any time you wanted to?
- Games. When is the last time you (or your child) has played a board game?
They would last a while. Compare that to Gameboys and the likes. Fast game,
lasts a few minutes, done. Another quick fix.
- Books. Remember those? Night after night, hiding your torch under the
covers to find out what would happen to the hero in the end. Compare that to
sticking a DVD in the player and staring for 90 minutes.
And that also brings me to imagination. I remember when we'd hammer some
sticks together to make guns. Now you just by your prefab AK-47 lookalike
from a shop. Remember when horror movies were scary because of what you
didn't see? Look at the Mummy. I can only laugh at the special effects.
They're now turning my favorite children's books into movies (because like
in music nobody can come up with anything new) and I refuse to go see them.
I'd rather remember what things looked like in my mind.....
Sorry for this ranting, I guess I just had to get it out of my system....
Duq
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In lugnet.general, Ronald Vallenduuk writes:
> I'm getting a bit tired of hearing this over and over again. Anybody wonder
> why kids have such short attention spans? I think it's because everything is
> prefab, readymade, spoonfed to them. Here's a few examples:
> - Children's TV. When I was young childrens TV was on wednesday afternoons
> and saturdays. That's it. Now when my daughter wants to see a cartoon she
> can flick on the telly any time of the week and choose from 30 channels. And
> then there's the programs themselves. Nothing lasts for more than a few
> minutes, and is interrupted for commercials.
Hmm...that's one of the sole reasons I'm a nonconformist.
Some can say the blessings of our society and technology
really better humanity, but is this really true? Is it
a 'blessing' that if someone is bored they instead turn
to the TV or video games to get their 'quick fix'?
Whenever anyone says 'I'm bored', I have to manually
fight the urge to shout at them and say 'What do you
mean you're bored?! There's thousands of things to do!
Why don't you play a board game, read a book or go
outside for once! Whatever happened to good old
imaginative activities?! What is this world coming to!"
> - Food. Remember when there wasn't a big M on every
> corner, and you couldn't have sweets any time you
> wanted to?
You know it. The ever present convenience
these days might also contribute to
elevated obesity levels and lethargy.
Corporations say they want the good of the
citizens, however, they only care for the
almighty dollar.
> - Games. When is the last time you (or your child) has played a board game?
> They would last a while. Compare that to Gameboys and the likes. Fast game,
> lasts a few minutes, done. Another quick fix.
Okay, I admit I play video games every once in a
while (I mean, who doesn't?). However, I believe
the real problem from this lies eerily reminscent
of alcoholism. It's up to the player to know
their own limits and when to quit. I do agree
with the board games though. We definitely need
more emphasis with the educational system on
the evils of convenience and questionable habits.
> - Books. Remember those? Night after night, hiding your torch under the
> covers to find out what would happen to the hero in the end. Compare that to
> sticking a DVD in the player and staring for 90 minutes.
Why does it seem more and more common that
it's a societal norm that the average person
reads around thirty minutes a day? Why don't
educators take a different stance on reading
and instead cast it in a better light.
(yes, the Educational, Learning labels
sometime discourage kids these days due to
the fact they perceive it as 'boring' and
'work'. Again, this points to the system!)
Place books on the front line of education.
You know, a great incentive would be to
place books in a manner in which they would
look and say. 'Wow! I never thought books
were more interesting than TV. Not everything
is just placed in front of me. I have to
derive meaning! I can rival foreign exchange
students!'. This would in turn, lead to more
imaginative individuals, resulting in greater
prosperity for those who benefit. Mandatory
year round schooling for all students would
also bode well. (less TV, more books!)
> And that also brings me to imagination. I remember when we'd hammer some
> sticks together to make guns. Now you just by your prefab AK-47 lookalike
> from a shop. Remember when horror movies were scary because of what you
> didn't see? Look at the Mummy. I can only laugh at the special effects.
Special effects are okay, but they generally kill
the cinema. I mean, who wants everything presented
on a silver platter? Why not imagine it yourself?
Also, the script writing is really bad at times,
and so strikingly obvious, it's almost cliche.
(Okay, the Adventurer will save the chick, Mr.
Fez will get eaten by scarabs and the pharoh
will be destroyed by some really odd sense of
'luck' devised in the eleventh hour by caffeine
buzzed scriptwriters. Seems pretty average to
me.)
> They're now turning my favorite children's books into movies (because like
> in music nobody can come up with anything new) and I refuse to go see them.
> I'd rather remember what things looked like in my mind.....
Adaptions kill the story-period. There's no
question about it other than profit. Why would
I want to see a movie about a book? Reading it,
there is always greater clarity to the story,
and I don't have to pay the extra money to
read it again.
> Sorry for this ranting, I guess I just had to get it out of my system....
No, ranting is great! Whenever someone rants
on lugnet, It's always entertaining to a great
extent to read the threads and reactions by
other community members. (that's why I've
stayed with Lugnet so long.)
Down with juniorization!
<<_Matt Hein_>>
Fellow lego enthusias
O s p r e y
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In lugnet.general, Matt Hein writes:
> In lugnet.general, Ronald Vallenduuk writes:
>
> > I'm getting a bit tired of hearing this over and over again. Anybody wonder
> > why kids have such short attention spans? I think it's because everything is
> > prefab, readymade, spoonfed to them. Here's a few examples:
> > - Children's TV. When I was young childrens TV was on wednesday afternoons
> > and saturdays. That's it. Now when my daughter wants to see a cartoon she
> > can flick on the telly any time of the week and choose from 30 channels. And
> > then there's the programs themselves. Nothing lasts for more than a few
> > minutes, and is interrupted for commercials.
>
> Hmm...that's one of the sole reasons I'm a nonconformist.
What are the other sole reasons? ;-)
Cheers
Richie
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In lugnet.general, Matt Hein writes:
> In lugnet.general, Ronald Vallenduuk writes:
> > - Games. When is the last time you (or your child) has played a board game?
> > They would last a while. Compare that to Gameboys and the likes. Fast game,
> > lasts a few minutes, done. Another quick fix.
>
> Okay, I admit I play video games every once in a
> while (I mean, who doesn't?). However, I believe
> the real problem from this lies eerily reminscent
> of alcoholism. It's up to the player to know
> their own limits and when to quit. I do agree
> with the board games though. We definitely need
> more emphasis with the educational system on
> the evils of convenience and questionable habits.
Not every board game lasts as long as Monopoly or a marathon game of Go. And
there's plenty of kids who play RPGs that take up to 100 hours to finish, so
I'm gonna have to disagree on just plain (video) "games" being the problem.
Even short-attention-span games require about 10x more investment of
attention than most children's TV programs. Agreed with just about every
other point, though.
-Greg "Fox" Cook
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In lugnet.general, Gregory Cook writes:
> Not every board game lasts as long as Monopoly or a marathon game of Go. And
> there's plenty of kids who play RPGs that take up to 100 hours to finish, so
> I'm gonna have to disagree on just plain (video) "games" being the problem.
> Even short-attention-span games require about 10x more investment of
> attention than most children's TV programs. Agreed with just about every
> other point, though.
>
> -Greg "Fox" Cook
No, probably not. I admit plenty of
attention is needed to play (I don't
believe I stated otherwise.) However,
when people begin to grow dependent
on video games for entertainment, it
is common that they tend to play for
long periods of time per week (let's
say around four to five hours per day).
This is usually a signature of an
addict. (This commitment to playing
for extensive periods of time, a.k.a
'slacking', is a very prevalent trait
among a lot of my friends and comrades
at school.)
Actually, I have a definite fondness for
RPGs and tactical Espionage games (like
Final Fantasy and Metal Gear.), so they're
rather inspiring. I haven't played them for
quite a while though. (waiting for the
sequels.)
<<_Matt Hein_>>
Fellow lego enthusiast
O s p r e y
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In lugnet.general, Matt Hein writes:
> In lugnet.general, Gregory Cook writes:
>
> > Not every board game lasts as long as Monopoly or a marathon game of Go. And
> > there's plenty of kids who play RPGs that take up to 100 hours to finish, so
> > I'm gonna have to disagree on just plain (video) "games" being the problem.
> > Even short-attention-span games require about 10x more investment of
> > attention than most children's TV programs. Agreed with just about every
> > other point, though.
> >
> > -Greg "Fox" Cook
>
> No, probably not. I admit plenty of
> attention is needed to play (I don't
> believe I stated otherwise.) However,
> when people begin to grow dependent
> on video games for entertainment, it
> is common that they tend to play for
> long periods of time per week (let's
> say around four to five hours per day).
> This is usually a signature of an
> addict. (This commitment to playing
> for extensive periods of time, a.k.a
> 'slacking', is a very prevalent trait
> among a lot of my friends and comrades
> at school.)
I was under the impression that all the problems being listed in the post(s)
I replied to were related to the short attention spans being cultivated in
new generations these days. Addiction to one form of entertainment may be
bad, but it's a wildly different problem than ADHD/short-attention-span
(almost an opposite problem, really. intense concentration on only one thing
to the exclusion of all others as opposed to not being able to do any one
thing for more than a few minutes).
So anyway, I wasn't saying anything about addiction to games, just that
there are plenty of long-attention-span games out there, not just short span
ones.
-Greg "Fox" Cook
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Yeah, but a lot of this comes down to parents who should really monitor what
their children are doing and make sure they don't do too much of one thing -
be it watch TV, play video games or even read books or play with lego.
Video games have an advantage over board games in that you can play them
when no-one else is willing to play a game with you (It's one of the reasons
I play video games - I have a large collection of board games, but my
friends rarely have time to come over and play). I also think playing a
Video Game is better than just watching a TV program, as at least with the
game you are learning skills and solving puzzles.
> - Food. Remember when there wasn't a big M on every corner, and you couldn't
> have sweets any time you wanted to?
Most children I know now can't have sweets whenever they want to.
> - Books. Remember those? Night after night, hiding your torch under the
> covers to find out what would happen to the hero in the end.
Yep - it's funny how I now need to wear glasses :) Of course, another
thing to blame for this is how many parents now read stories to their
children instead of just directing to the TV set?
> And that also brings me to imagination. I remember when we'd hammer some
> sticks together to make guns.
Or just two fingers. Or we built them out of lego bricks (Note to kids
reading - don't fight with swords made out of lego - you get one good swing
and that's it :( ). Of course you could just be a responsible parents and
ban your children from owning toy guns. At which point they will then go and
make them out of stick/fingers or lego bricks.
> Remember when horror movies were scary because of what you didn't see?
Ummm. No - I grew up in the eighties, so I remember watching mostly
splatter movies. Scared the willies out of me. I still get scared by
American Werewolf in London as my friend's parents took us to see it at the
drive-in. We were 10 years old...
> Look at the Mummy. I can only laugh at the special effects.
The Mummy's not really a horror movie though, it's more in the style of
Indiana Jones (And it's a fun film).
> They're now turning my favorite children's books into movies and I refuse to >go see them. I'd rather remember what things looked like in my mind.....
An idea could be to make your child read the book before taking them to
see the movie. That way they'd start realising that the book was better (in
99% of the cases anyway - sometimes a movie comes along that is better than
the book)
> (because like in music nobody can come up with anything new)
Musicians come up with new stuff all the time - but the record labels
deem it as 'not popular' or can't figure out how to market it so it doesn't
ever make it into the mainstream. Boo :(
Steve
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"Steve Burge" <steveburge@b_i_g_f_o_o_t.com> wrote in message
news:H856EB.6DA@lugnet.com...
<snip> Video games have an advantage over board games in that you can play
them when no-one else is willing to play a game with you</snip>
Isn't that down to those same parents again? In our house we used to play
boardgames and do big jigsaws together, especially in winter time.
<snip>I also think playing a Video Game is better than just watching a TV
program, as at least with the game you are learning skills and solving
puzzles.</snip>
That'll really depend on the game and the TV program you're comparing. I'm
not sure how much you learn from endlessly playing doom-clones, and there
are lots of good educational TV programs on.
<snip>Musicians come up with new stuff all the time - but the record labels
deem it as 'not popular' or can't figure out how to market it so it doesn't
ever make it into the mainstream. Boo :( </snip>
This is heading for off-topic....
I know what you're saying. With current record company politics U2 would
never have made it. Their first two albums didn't sell that well. It's
amazing though what marketing can do. Absolute crap covers of 70's and 80's
hits that nobody needs sell like mad. How many cloned boybands does the
world need anyway?
Duq
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In lugnet.general, Ronald Vallenduuk writes:
>
> "Bob Gomez" <kukumba@aol.com> wrote in message news:H83wI4.56M@lugnet.com...
> <snip> I guess some will say that the market has changed and kids today
> don't have
> the attention span that they used to. </snip>
>
> I'm getting a bit tired of hearing this over and over again. Anybody wonder
> why kids have such short attention spans? I think it's because everything is
> prefab, readymade, spoonfed to them. Here's a few examples:
> - Children's TV. When I was young childrens TV was on wednesday afternoons
> and saturdays. That's it. Now when my daughter wants to see a cartoon she
> can flick on the telly any time of the week and choose from 30 channels. And
> then there's the programs themselves. Nothing lasts for more than a few
> minutes, and is interrupted for commercials.
The 24 hour cartoon channels are great! They keep my bird entertained while
I'm at work (he likes Nick the best).
As to children, just don't let them watch all the time (though in truth I'll
sit and watch The Fairly Oddparents or Samurai Jack with my son - there's a
lot of good cartoons out these days, much better than in the past).
> - Food. Remember when there wasn't a big M on every corner, and you couldn't
> have sweets any time you wanted to?
Considering the state of my teeth and my wife's teeth, and the disgustingly
perfect state of my son's teeth, I think you got that backwards.
> - Games. When is the last time you (or your child) has played a board game?
> They would last a while. Compare that to Gameboys and the likes. Fast game,
> lasts a few minutes, done. Another quick fix.
Last time we played a board game? Coming up at 11 AM today: Trans-America,
Puerto Rico, Wildlife, Liberte. There are so many great board games
available today (if you go to game stores and not get the standard issue TRU
trash). But then, the walk in pantry in our kitchen is wall-to-wall
boardgames, so perhaps mine is not the typical family.
> - Books. Remember those? Night after night, hiding your torch under the
> covers to find out what would happen to the hero in the end. Compare that to
> sticking a DVD in the player and staring for 90 minutes.
That can work both ways. My son liked the Lord of the Rings movies so much
he is now reading The Hobbit. But in general, there are more distractions,
so it is up to parents to make sure their children read.
> And that also brings me to imagination. I remember when we'd hammer some
> sticks together to make guns. Now you just by your prefab AK-47 lookalike
> from a shop. Remember when horror movies were scary because of what you
> didn't see? Look at the Mummy. I can only laugh at the special effects.
> They're now turning my favorite children's books into movies (because like
> in music nobody can come up with anything new) and I refuse to go see them.
> I'd rather remember what things looked like in my mind.....
Ahhhhh! No realistic guns! None. Cops get a report that someone is
creeping around with a gun and show up hyped up for a shoot-out!
But the kids do love the big bright water soakers. None of those wimpy
squirt guns!
The current Mummy was more of an adventure flick than horror, and that was
by intent. Now, Alien was *scary* (first show, big theatre, wonderful
high-backed seats to isolate you, thin crowd, nothing but you, the alien,
and no knowing what was to happen).
But a good comparison would be the original The Haunting where you never
really see anything and it's all implied, and the current version with all
it's high tech special effects. Watch the first in all its black and white
glory, trash the second.
A lack of Tecnic is not the end of western civilization. I just got my son
The Big Ball Factory from K*Nex for Christmas. The darn thing is taller
than him. He had a great time with it. But I understand the complaint
about not getting your favorite stuff - if Lego ended Castle and Pirates I'd
be down, too...
...oh wait. Darn. Time to turn on B.B. King and Buddy Guy. I got those
Lego-Lost blues again...
-->Bruce<--
I got those Lego blues again
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In lugnet.general, Ronald Vallenduuk writes:
> Sorry for this ranting, I guess I just had to get it out of my system....
We need more ranting, not less. Rants almost always give greater insight into
your personal experience, and that can only be beneficial. It may not be the
easiest thing to swallow, but truth is like that.
I agree with you on every other point, though. I actually stopped playing video
games for more than a half-hour each day because it cut into my reading time.
(more evidence that I need mental help, in some people's books!). I think the
best way to combat such decay is to develop a few outside interests that compete
for time. I'm not pretending to be an expert or even properly knowledgeable on
the subject. Just giving you a little something to chew on.
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