 | | | | | | |
| |
|
Aaron West wrote:
<snip>
>
> While I love the special attention given this TRAINS/TOWN line by LEGO,
> WHERE ARE the other popular themes of CASTLE, PIRATES and SPACE headed!! It
> seems to me that all the folk at LEGO Direct love their TRAINS/TOWN and that
> the new releases are bent that way. Don't let there be a Christmas without
> CASTLE, PIRATES and SPACE again!!! (I want to buy my kids LEGO for X-Mas,
> but I can't do TRAINS three years in a row without them saying, "Not
> again!") Don't let your market slip away LEGO!
Hm. A better question might be "WHERE ARE the fan clubs for the other
popular themes of CASTLE, PIRATE, and SPACE?" There are at least twelve
organized LEGO train clubs in the US, plus clubs in the rest of the
world as well. Each club holds regular, highly public shows each year,
and directly inspires interest in the LEGO Trains line.
> This rant is due to the latest Shop At Home catalog I received, man is it
> dull! The only bright gems for multiple set buying (for parts) are the
> Harry Potter, LEDGENDS or some STAR WARS. The ISLAND EXTREME is really
> limited in usefulness, JACK STONE is boring even to my 5 year old, GALIDOR
> does not inspire him or me at all and the only way we can seem to get sets
> with real bricks is to NOT BUY FROM LEGO, but rather from Bricklink or eBay!
> My son loves the TRAIN line, but he wants a little variety that is as well
> made. So do I.
Your tone suggests that you are not particularly interested in the play
value of a set, but rather what parts it contains. While I feel the same
way about most sets I buy, you should recognize that we are in the
minority, and probably not really a large part of LEGO's main target
market. The skateboard park set has terrific play value, and my son and
I have already clocked a dozen hours with it.
> Can I have a job at LEGO Direct so I can get more CASTLE, PIRATES and SPACE
> themes added to with more re-issues and new designs!?!???
> Brad? Did you hear me? Put a CASTLE-head, SPACE-head or scurvy-PIRATE on
> the payroll of your department, and I've officially requested all three
> positions for ME!
My guess is that LEGO Direct employees don't have any more input into
the production process than fans do. Decisions like that are usally
based on production schedules, market research, and other non-emotional
factors.
Finally, you should be aware that ranting often comes across as whining,
and is generally not effective in producing change, since your audience
assumes you are not a reasonable person. I would suggest you take action
instead. Form a LEGO Castle [1] club, and display Castle [1] layouts at
local fairs, toy stores, and malls. Post pictures of the display and the
crowds that attend. Show LEGO there is enough interest in the line to
support five to ten such clubs in the U.S., then organize a formal
meeting with LEGO Direct, and propose some ideas.
And best of luck to you! I look forward to attending a Castle [1] show!
Rick C.
[1] or Pirate or Space
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| |
|
In lugnet.castle, Rick Clark writes:
> Aaron West wrote:
>
> Hm. A better question might be "WHERE ARE the fan clubs for the other
> popular themes of CASTLE, PIRATE, and SPACE?" There are at least twelve
> organized LEGO train clubs in the US, plus clubs in the rest of the
> world as well. Each club holds regular, highly public shows each year,
> and directly inspires interest in the LEGO Trains line.
I see plenty of clubs: WAMALUG, NELUG, MICHLUG, etc. These cater to all Lego
fans.
As for Train Shows, virtually NONE are comprised of a single Lego Train layout,
and organized by said train club. They're invited to model railroading shows,
not as Lego bricks built into trains, but model trains built out of Lego.
There is no such thing as a National Model Castle Association or National Model
Spaceship Association, with regional shows. There just is not enough interest
to sustain such things. Lego is releasing a large number of train sets because
that is currently where they are getting free advertising (and consequently
increased sales): from the layouts at shows.
Jeff
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| |
|
In lugnet.castle, Jeff Stembel writes:
> In lugnet.castle, Rick Clark writes:
> > Aaron West wrote:
> >
> > Hm. A better question might be "WHERE ARE the fan clubs for the other
> > popular themes of CASTLE, PIRATE, and SPACE?" There are at least twelve
> > organized LEGO train clubs in the US, plus clubs in the rest of the
> > world as well. Each club holds regular, highly public shows each year,
> > and directly inspires interest in the LEGO Trains line.
<snip>
> As for Train Shows, virtually NONE are comprised of a single Lego Train layout,
> and organized by said train club. They're invited to model railroading shows,
> not as Lego bricks built into trains, but model trains built out of Lego.
> There is no such thing as a National Model Castle Association or National Model
> Spaceship Association, with regional shows.
Oh no, we here in the NGLTC often do stand alone shows that we are invited
to do, or think up ourselves. We've done display at the Atlanta History
Center during the Christmas holidays, the Festival of Trees (also Christmas
themed), we done layouts at local shopping centers, including the LEGO
Outlet stores, we've done layouts at small town festivals. Also I know of
many other train clubs that have done layouts at their local TRUs.
So train clubs don't wait for the "big" train shows to have an excuse to
show our hobby to the public, we are always on the look out for an situation
to be able to do so.
> Lego is releasing a large number of train sets because
> that is currently where they are getting free advertising (and consequently
> increased sales): from the layouts at shows.
Exactly Rick's point.
jt
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| |
|
In lugnet.castle, James Trobaugh writes:
> In lugnet.castle, Jeff Stembel writes:
> > As for Train Shows, virtually NONE are comprised of a single Lego Train layout,
> > and organized by said train club. They're invited to model railroading shows,
> > not as Lego bricks built into trains, but model trains built out of Lego.
> > There is no such thing as a National Model Castle Association or National Model
> > Spaceship Association, with regional shows.
>
> Oh no, we here in the NGLTC often do stand alone shows that we are invited
> to do, or think up ourselves. We've done display at the Atlanta History
> Center during the Christmas holidays, the Festival of Trees (also Christmas
> themed), we done layouts at local shopping centers, including the LEGO
> Outlet stores, we've done layouts at small town festivals. Also I know of
> many other train clubs that have done layouts at their local TRUs.
>
> So train clubs don't wait for the "big" train shows to have an excuse to
> show our hobby to the public, we are always on the look out for an situation
> to be able to do so.
>
>
>
> > Lego is releasing a large number of train sets because
> > that is currently where they are getting free advertising (and consequently
> > increased sales): from the layouts at shows.
>
> Exactly Rick's point.
>
> jt
This is way too crossposted.
Jude
XFUT .trains
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| |
|
In lugnet.castle, Jeff Stembel writes:
> In lugnet.castle, Rick Clark writes:
> > Aaron West wrote:
> >
> > Hm. A better question might be "WHERE ARE the fan clubs for the other
> > popular themes of CASTLE, PIRATE, and SPACE?" There are at least twelve
> > organized LEGO train clubs in the US, plus clubs in the rest of the
> > world as well. Each club holds regular, highly public shows each year,
> > and directly inspires interest in the LEGO Trains line.
>
> I see plenty of clubs: WAMALUG, NELUG, MICHLUG, etc. These cater to all Lego
> fans.
> ...There is no such thing as a National Model Castle Association or National Model
> Spaceship Association, with regional shows. There just is not enough interest
> to sustain such things.
But there are plenty of local/regional opportunities. In MichLUG, we have
done space and castle displays at science fiction conventions and some
members have done a fundraiser for a local church with train, space, and
castle. It's just a matter of getting in touch with people with like
interests and doing some footwork in finding places to display.
Peter
FUT .general--maybe not the best place for this but we need to get this
discussion out of all the theme groups.
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| |
|
In lugnet.lego.direct, Peter Guenther writes:
> In lugnet.castle, Jeff Stembel writes:
> > In lugnet.castle, Rick Clark writes:
> > I see plenty of clubs: WAMALUG, NELUG, MICHLUG, etc. These cater to all Lego
> > fans.
>
> > ...There is no such thing as a National Model Castle Association or
> > National Model Spaceship Association, with regional shows. There just
> > is not enough interest
> > to sustain such things.
>
> But there are plenty of local/regional opportunities. In MichLUG, we have
> done space and castle displays at science fiction conventions and some
> members have done a fundraiser for a local church with train, space, and
> castle. It's just a matter of getting in touch with people with like
> interests and doing some footwork in finding places to display.
>
> Peter
>
> FUT .general--maybe not the best place for this but we need to get this
> discussion out of all the theme groups.
maybe lugnet.org? crossposted there since it does seem like a topic that
might be of some interest to organizations everywhere
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| |
|
Jeff Stembel wrote:
>
> In lugnet.castle, Rick Clark writes:
> > Aaron West wrote:
> >
> > Hm. A better question might be "WHERE ARE the fan clubs for the other
> > popular themes of CASTLE, PIRATE, and SPACE?" There are at least twelve
> > organized LEGO train clubs in the US, plus clubs in the rest of the
> > world as well. Each club holds regular, highly public shows each year,
> > and directly inspires interest in the LEGO Trains line.
>
> I see plenty of clubs: WAMALUG, NELUG, MICHLUG, etc. These cater to all Lego
> fans.
>
> As for Train Shows, virtually NONE are comprised of a single Lego Train layout,
> and organized by said train club. They're invited to model railroading shows,
> not as Lego bricks built into trains, but model trains built out of Lego.
> There is no such thing as a National Model Castle Association or National Model
> Spaceship Association, with regional shows. There just is not enough interest
> to sustain such things. Lego is releasing a large number of train sets because
> that is currently where they are getting free advertising (and consequently
> increased sales): from the layouts at shows.
Well, PNLTC is doing a good job of bucking this trend. I am slowly
recovering from my first day at a PNLTC show. We have lined up a store
front in a mall for the rest of the summer. Today was our first open
house. We have been building the layout over the past week (after a
couple weeks of planning and brainstorming).
The layout has three main "islands" connected by long bridges. One
island is a farm scene, the next, large island, includes a city, a yard,
some more city, then Kim Toll's mountain town, and finally a few more
city buildings. The last island is a waterfront area with Jeremy Rear's
container and naval yard, and my brand new work in progress 12v coastal
town layout.
Sitting on it's own at the front of the store is Matt Chiles's roller
coaster which is an absolute technical marvel, especially when you get
several runs in a row without a problem.
As far as why do the other themes not have shows so much: Simply, it
helps a lot (especially when a group is starting) to piggyback on other
events (we're even piggybacking our open houses on the mall's monthly
trading card show). From a modeling perspective, model railroading is
certainly the most organized group, and I think it has a lot to do with
the dynamic nature of model railroads, and the completeness of the
simulation (which I have mentioned before, no other modeling hobby lets
you simulate, in an automated way, the system being modeled so
completely [I added the "in an automated way" because one could argue
that war games and role playing games are pretty complete simulations,
but you don't get to just sit back and watch them happen]). Of course
the various rocketry and radio control hobbies have lots of group
gathers, but LEGO will have a harder time penetrating those areas.
LEGO wargaming may be the next big thing which allows AFOLS to reach out
to non-AFOLS in a public way. Of course the key to do that will be to
make the games take advantage of the strengths of LEGO and provide game
systems which lend themselves to the brick (I think Brickwars and Evil
Stevie's Pirate Game both do so in their own ways).
Other venues will start to provide ways to publicize other themes.
Putting on a big space display at a Science Fiction convention (which of
course has been done) is a great way to share and interact. Displays at
libraries or museums can be a way to share castles (and you can gain
interaction by having an open house where there is an opportunity to
meet the artists).
As to why is LD spending so much effort on trains: While the train shows
are certainly a factor in LD's decisions on what sets are introduced, I
think perhaps a larger reason is the perception that TLC's train
offerings are no where's near to supplying the demand, and that lack has
been going on for longer than the other themes. Of course part of the
problem is how to market trains. They're hard to market because the
entry level is a $100-150 set, as opposed to the entry level for say
castle or space where a $20 set can give you a good taste. And then of
course you need additional accessories...
This last point is perhaps another reason the model railroading hobby
involves much more shows. While you can spend an awful lot on RC or
model rockets, I suspect the percentage of fans who spend a significant
amount of their income on those is much less than for trains. Again, it
returns to the modeling a complete system. You need a table. You need
some more trains. You need scenery. You need some more trains. You need
houses. You need some more trains. You need little people and cars. Oh,
and you need a larger table to have room for all those trains, which
means you need more... Of course once you've spent all this money, you
want to share your hobby (plus, you'll never have space at home to run
that really really long train). Oh, and a show gives the opportunity for
vendors to sell you more things you just gotta have. Wrap that all up
with an admission fee, and the show coordinators are actually willing to
shell out a few bucks to the exhibitors.
Back to the completeness of simulation aspect, guess which hobby also
has lots of conventions...
I'm probably all wet on the RC and model rocketry though. I've never
been involved in those hobbies, so the shows and such are probably
there, and folks probably do spend as much money as model railroaders.
But they're still not nearly as good fits for LEGO as trains.
In the end though, I think I've got a better idea of why showing LEGO at
train shows is so much more common than other themes. In the end, the
model railroaders recognize that LEGO trains are an expression of the
hobby which is far more accessible to kids. And that may be the reason
you won't see an upswelling of LEGO at RC and model rocketry. There are
plenty of RC cars which are perfectly accessible to kids. Model rocketry
is plenty accessible to kids old enough to participate safely (and heck,
younger kids can always be handed to button to push when it is safe to
launch, and any kid will get just as much satisfaction from watching the
launch as the adults do).
Frank
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| |
|
In lugnet.general, Frank Filz writes:
[snip]
> Well, PNLTC is doing a good job of bucking this trend. I am slowly
> recovering from my first day at a PNLTC show. We have lined up a store
> front in a mall for the rest of the summer. Today was our first open
> house. We have been building the layout over the past week (after a
> couple weeks of planning and brainstorming).
>
> The layout has three main "islands" connected by long bridges. One
> island is a farm scene, the next, large island, includes a city, a yard,
> some more city, then Kim Toll's mountain town, and finally a few more
> city buildings. The last island is a waterfront area with Jeremy Rear's
> container and naval yard, and my brand new work in progress 12v coastal
> town layout.
>
> Sitting on it's own at the front of the store is Matt Chiles's roller
> coaster which is an absolute technical marvel, especially when you get
> several runs in a row without a problem.
>
>
[snip]
> Frank
At some point I am hoping pictures will appear. [I have already zoomed over
to the PNLTC site where I thought there might be a shot or two ... but not
yet... soon? please?] To have a semi-permanent community/club display
sounds like a dream. Often it seems for a show more time is spent in the
initial setup and final breakdown than for the show itself. Ah, to have the
luxury of time, a whole summer to refine the dispay... but it is a serious
commitment of time to staff the display for public viewing. I am curious to
see the display and to hear a range viewpoints on how this goes.
As always, thanks bunches for the report Frank!
be well,
sheree
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| |
|
> In the end though, I think I've got a better idea of why showing LEGO at
> train shows is so much more common than other themes. In the end, the
> model railroaders recognize that LEGO trains are an expression of the
> hobby which is far more accessible to kids.
> Frank
> In the end though, I think I've got a better idea of why showing LEGO at
> train shows is so much more common than other themes. In the end, the
> model railroaders recognize that LEGO trains are an expression of the
> hobby which is far more accessible to kids
Well said, Frank. I am currently in the process of inventorying my N-scale model
railroad collection in order to sell it (well, maybe I'll keep the Southern Rwy
F3A-B set from Kato) and jump into Lego railroading with both feet (and
wallet!).
The reason: my 4-year-old daughter and 1-year-old son. My time is a precious
commodity and spending it with my kids and wife when I am able to is a major
priority. I cannot, nor do I want to, justify spending hours in the basement
with trains that are too delicate for my kids to handle. With Lego, when my
daughter shows an interest in trains and asks, "Can I see that?" I am able to
say "Yes! And you can touch it too, and even take it apart if you want." Believe
me, there is nothing quite like sharing something you love with your children,
and seeing that look in their eyes when you KNOW they're hooked.
Just this week, my daughter and I went to the dedication of a former US Navy
caboose being displayed at the La Plata, Md., train station. Why do I think my
daughter enjoyed it so much? Because she was able to participate with daddy in
something that was important to me. And because we can build a replica of that
caboose, together, using Lego.
Perhaps one day, when my children are grown, I'll get back to "scale" model
railroading. But maybe not, after all, there are grandchildren to think about ;)
Besides, my wife has a morbid fascination with "train wrecks," and it's a lot
easier to clean up a Lego wreck than see your new $100 (or more) N-scale loco in
pieces (not that she's actually wrecked one of those yet, she just suggests how
"neat" it would be).
Henry Durand
(whose first building for a Lego layout will be a minifig hospital)
| | | | | | |
