Subject:
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Re: Nature of man (was Re: Problems with Christianity)
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Newsgroups:
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lugnet.off-topic.debate
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Date:
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Wed, 31 Jan 2001 05:23:23 GMT
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Viewed:
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669 times
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In lugnet.off-topic.debate, Dave Schuler writes:
> > > But according to others in this group, man doesn't HAVE free will - God knows
> > > everything anyone will do from cradle to grave - where is the free will in
> > > that?
> >
> > Well, I can't speak for others, but here is one take on it. (and I haven't
> > thought this through overly much, so it may have holes...)
> >
> > I don't see a contradiction.
> >
> > If I choose to (X), or to not (X), how does God knowing ahead of time which
> > I will choose affect my making the choice? The position that God's
> > knowledge of my choice will affect my choice implies that God is dictating
> > my choice to me ahead of time, which, AFAIK, isn't happening.
>
> Right, but Tom isn't just saying that God decides in advance which way we'll
> turn out; Tom is asserting, I believe, that in order for the outcome of an
> event to be known in advance with absolute certainty, that event must be
> pre-set in some way, and therefore freewill is an illusion. I'm not talking
> about knowing a range of probable outcomes, but rather the unquestionable
> certainty that God would have. Again, I'm not saying that God is choosing my
> future course for me, but in order for that future course to be absolutely
> known now, it must already be set, so my free will is irrelevant.
Can God actually be limited to our subjective experience? Assuming that our path
is unique in the near infinity of possible universes, all of which God
understands totally, is it actually possible for God to comprehend how linear
this consciousness is? Beyond time and space all events are simultaneous and
eternal, unique and universal. If God sees everything in our history and in
every possible history as one moment, is anything really determined? Perhaps we
can have free will for ourselves, and at the same time know that God doesn't see
us making any choices.
I don't know if this makes sense to anyone else, but it does show me why the
idea of Christ is amazing. How you understand that idea is up to you of course.
--DaveL
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